tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7026450255174007652.post6675722187108633509..comments2024-03-27T21:50:33.178-04:00Comments on Betrayed Wives' Club: We Must Forgive Ourselves FirstEllehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/13470499558973726796noreply@blogger.comBlogger88125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7026450255174007652.post-27925849129269946152015-08-19T10:28:02.257-04:002015-08-19T10:28:02.257-04:00Hopeful,
From the night i found out the full truth...Hopeful,<br />From the night i found out the full truth of my husband's affair, I pressed for details. And I have asked questions that in hindsight, I wish I never had. Some of the details were too much for me. Most of those came early on though and after doing that a few times, I decided that I would write my questions down and wait 24 hours. If I still felt compelled to know the answer, I asked it then. That really helped save me from asking things that would hurt more then help. And Melissa is absolutely right when she says that your perspective changes as you heal. Initially, I felt like I needed and absolute number of exactly how many times my husband had sex with the OW. My husband and I figured out an approximate and I'm okay with that. Because ultimately, the bottom line is that he carried on a sexual affair with her off and on for over a year. The betrayal happened before they ever even had sex. He doesn't remember a lot of specific dates or conversations and the reality is that his memory has always been crap.<br />That kind of leads into your other point about their recollection of the affair. It is terribly shameful for a lot of unfaithful people when they look back and realize what they've done. It's easier for some to just try to block it out. Another possibility, and one that I'm processing now, is that often the affair partner, their "relationship", the conversations, etc.., just weren't that important to them. The OW in my situation was a means to an end. She fed his ego and gave him sex, both things that were lacking in our marriage. In one meeting with our therapist, I was expressing how frustrated I was with his lack of memory for specific conversations with and details about the OW. The therapist kind of put the question back to my husband and his answer was that it really didn't matter that much. I've just recently realized that he doesn't even remember when her birthday is. As petty as it is, that makes me feel a little better.<br />Baded on my personal experience, I would just encourage you to give thought to your questions before you ask them. Definitely pursue them if you need the information to heal, but if it's something you are on the fence about, give yourself some time. You can always go back and ask it later if the need to know stays with you.<br />Hugs!Dandelionnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7026450255174007652.post-76884365847189773662015-08-18T23:16:33.886-04:002015-08-18T23:16:33.886-04:00Hopeful, I too wanted details. It is actually ver...Hopeful, I too wanted details. It is actually very common for a woman who finds out of her husband's affair. My husband also had a very difficult time with the timeline of the affair as well as when it went from emotional to sexual. I still don't know that part, for sure. I did see that my husband put forth effort to try to find it out for me. He talked to friends about events and get-togethers that would help him with the timeline. He also reviewed photographs and his computer. He really was trying to piece it together for me, and even for him because he truly cannot believe that much time had passed. He has always been very weak with details regarding time and has always looked to me for that kind of information. Your need for details changes over time. And your need for what type of details. And that's a good thing. As much as I want to know when my husband's affair went from emotional to physical, in the end, it doesn't really matter. He had an affair on me. Period. My friend whose husband had an affair between 2008 and 2010, now, she has a hard time remembering the details that she did find out. And I've heard that from many others who are further along in their reconciliation. There are actually some great articles on the Internet about why men a) don't want to share the details and b) cannot recall the details. Reading some of those articles helped me as well.<br />Trust your instinct and your need to know. If it's burning and you really need to know, do all that you can to find out… But, if you can rest with it, just let it be. and if there is truly no way to know without causing both of you great anxiety, I would just let it be as well.<br />Hugs and kissesMelissahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15625911085419338023noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7026450255174007652.post-56542273331651529582015-08-17T13:30:48.481-04:002015-08-17T13:30:48.481-04:00So I am still struggling with the lack of details ...So I am still struggling with the lack of details from the affair. They were sporadic with long periods of no communication so he says he cannot remember details. And he also says he hated it so something he tried to erase. Only reason he kept at it was he thought he had done permanent damage. But ended one afrair and the other has only been sporadic texts and emails for 6 years. But I struggle not knowing when things began and ended and how they communicated. Really what I see as basic questions. I do not want to know details at all. He says he wants to flush it and it is such a dark part of his past. I feel I need to understand what went on and wonder does he get it all even? And I also feel I need to process what happened in our marriage good and bad for so many years. Even though since there were only 7 times he was with two women over 10 years. I am so confused. <br /><br />Everything is going really well with us now. He is supportive and saying the right things. It is hard to know will details help me work through this or make if worse for me? Will it push him too far? I feel like in a way it is him having ultimate control of what happens which is a pattern in our marriage. Not in a terrible way but me giving in to him. Just wondering if this is the time where I put my foot down and demand what I think I need. The problem is I hope it will help me and us. <br /><br />Would love any thought from those who have been through this. Thanks!Hopefull 30noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7026450255174007652.post-52645419353889304512015-08-17T07:41:06.995-04:002015-08-17T07:41:06.995-04:00The day got much better - not because of what we d...The day got much better - not because of what we did - and we enjoyed a movie, pedicures and dinner, but because we talked about us ... we are still both not sure ... but here and somehow know that's where we belong right now.Melissahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15625911085419338023noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7026450255174007652.post-89415128394576491832015-08-16T20:17:09.095-04:002015-08-16T20:17:09.095-04:00I kind of had to laugh at this...my name Rachelle,...I kind of had to laugh at this...my name Rachelle, the other woman, Michelle...sometimes you just have to laugh and shake it off ;)Rachellenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7026450255174007652.post-12194035095802051782015-08-16T19:42:38.499-04:002015-08-16T19:42:38.499-04:00Small steps, yep. Amazing what a bit of empathy an...Small steps, yep. Amazing what a bit of empathy and compassion can do. Those gestures that let us know how sorry they are and how they wish they could undo our pain go a long way.Ellehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13470499558973726796noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7026450255174007652.post-11903299826747356602015-08-16T19:40:30.487-04:002015-08-16T19:40:30.487-04:00Yes, you must forgive yourself. After 20 months ou...Yes, you must forgive yourself. After 20 months out of hell, here is what my healing looks like so far and I hope this encourages those still stuck in betrayal hell. <br /><br />1. I have grown personally and know myself so must better. I'm not fooling myself anymore. Or as Elle says relearned. <br /><br />2. My self esteem has improved, yes, I do slip back into old habits when stressed out but who doesn't.<br /><br />3. My husband has to live with himself, I don't take that responsibility anymore. That is purely on him. <br /><br />4. I didn't lose my self respect, morals, my family's respect or trust. He lost it all. <br /><br />5. I found my voice and I'm not afraid to use it. <br />Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17219895095283341385noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7026450255174007652.post-86400855394826676562015-08-16T16:17:30.564-04:002015-08-16T16:17:30.564-04:00Hang in there. My H had told me what i thought was...Hang in there. My H had told me what i thought was all of it ... i felt relived of my obsessing over details assumptions and could sleep again. Then WHAM that wasnt it .... sure he told me most of everthing omitting he recently had been in contact again and had sex 1 time after dday on a day i now know something seemed off and my gut was telling me so but i didnt listen. Finding out there is more was much like dday i expressed i was feeling more in touch and shuffling vs assuming details to be blind sided again ... someone said id rather be slapped with the truth then kissed with a lie. So true .... that night as i cried u lied again!!!!! Hurt so bad we had an all night talk cries and more details emerged ... some to much detail and now that i know it all or 90% at best it released him of the ow hold to tell me whatever it was shameful for him and burned like hell for me now we talk about alot more and hopefully nowhere to go now but up like elle says .... communication is key and hope it will lead us to healing i read nit just friends and enjoyed it. Take care. Woundednoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7026450255174007652.post-73056861298987712532015-08-16T11:18:33.258-04:002015-08-16T11:18:33.258-04:00Horrendous day ... it's our anniversary and al...Horrendous day ... it's our anniversary and all I can do is cry. He too is having a hard time ... and he is unable to comfort me. He says I require a lot of attention and maintenance... or something like that. I said one moment you love me and act as such ... the next you don't even like me ... he admitted that was true. I've been riding this emotional roller coaster since he said we should split about three months before DDay until now ... 10 months! The back and forth, "I love you ... and then lacking patience ... leaving for six weeks ... loving again ... and I'm talking this can be within days of each other ... the loving husband I knew and loved and the inpatient husband who I knew sometimes, but now, more often. Is he angry with himself? and taking it out on me? I haven't changed ... actually I have, but for the better. I'm helping a Lot in the yard; I'm expressing my gratitude so much more (and he wants me to stop thanking him for everything) ... we do see a new therapist this coming week. Let's hope it helps. Hugs all. Melissahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15625911085419338023noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7026450255174007652.post-15069956781984179852015-08-15T09:48:04.867-04:002015-08-15T09:48:04.867-04:00I am the anonymous you replied to above. We are ou...I am the anonymous you replied to above. We are out of town for my SIL's wedding. It is particularly hard as it is at the same church we got married in and our sixth anniversary is in two weeks. I recently Googled the OW and was surprised to find an arrest report online for a DUI. I now know she is 16 years older than me and my husband and have seen her photo (he verified it was her). I feel even more angry because of who she is. Like really?! This woman was worth destroying our marriage and causing me this pain. I hate her. From everything he told me, she aggressively pursued him, flirting with him at work and hitting on him at a work dinner. When she invited everyone back to her house, he was the only one to show up. She said, "Hold on, I need to go to the restroom" and came back naked. I am so angry because I wasn't there, but I constantly picture this in my head now. I can't get HER out of my head. I can't help but picture my husband who had previously never had sex with anyone but me, rolling on a condom to have sex with this disgusting older woman. How do I ever trust him again, not just to cheat, but how do I trust that he is the man I always thought he was. We have told no one. Except the counselor. I don't want people judging us or feeling sorry for me or gossiping. And my family history is such that I know they would crucify him and that would just make this harder for me. Jessicanoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7026450255174007652.post-81276472761425806302015-08-15T08:10:58.445-04:002015-08-15T08:10:58.445-04:00Sooo ... date night last night w group of people ....Sooo ... date night last night w group of people .... sit down good time waitress comes up she has same name as ow which isnt all that common .... r u fucking kidding me i tell my H under my breath .... my face became flush felt like i coukdnt swallow and thought best ti change my drink order to water ... dont need to give devil fire water ... i composed myself after a bit didnt ruin my night but was in ny mind some. ... just thought id share. Sighhhhh this will happen. I seriously wanted another waitress. H laughed not at me at situation more so like really? Said its just a name and it didnt bother him in slightest? True maybe isk but he can tell i was bothered and did try to help me. Woundednoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7026450255174007652.post-72599469074482522422015-08-15T00:04:09.936-04:002015-08-15T00:04:09.936-04:00Hopeful 30, of course you feel like DDay all over ...Hopeful 30, of course you feel like DDay all over again ... my husband did the same ... the trickle truth. And yes, it was devastating. The only thing which actually made it better was knowing it is a very real "phenomenon." And I wasn't alone. There were times it wasn't truth at all, but blatant lies. I couldn't grasp it ... this man I loved and trusted was looking me directly in the eyes and lying. Who can do that? Someone who is so incredibly frightened ... frightened and ashamed. May you find moments of peace and strength. May your husband do the same so that he can be vulnerable and as Peggy says, "responsibly honest."Melissahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15625911085419338023noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7026450255174007652.post-43211702920978123242015-08-14T19:34:11.559-04:002015-08-14T19:34:11.559-04:00Steam, it's so true what you said about leavin...Steam, it's so true what you said about leaving stones unturned. I wanted to rush through this and I'm finding that, as you said... you just can't. It hurts and it sucks and you just want to be OVER it. I believe it was Elle that pointed out that the only way out is through it. Lots of learning on his part and on mine, but I believe we will come out stronger. Dandelionnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7026450255174007652.post-75029102528638278702015-08-14T15:34:31.446-04:002015-08-14T15:34:31.446-04:00I was doing so well at almost 5 months. Really wel...I was doing so well at almost 5 months. Really well in fact. I was really working through the pain all the feelings about the affairs and our marriage pre dday. I always thought the story of when the affair started did not make sense but my husband kept to the story. Well ends up he moved it up by 4 years. I just feel terrible now. I feel like it is dday all over again. And on this one fact i had asked him over and over the past five months since it really did not make sense to me. I feel like i cannot breathe and like i am questioning myself again. He feels like it is a "speedbump". I get it i am not saying this erases some of the progress but i am just stunned. He keeps saying judge me from dday forward and i say yes but you lied to me all over again and to protect yourself not to help us. <br /><br />He swears on the lives of our children that there has been no contact except one text from the woman and he showed me and his reply to stop texting him. He swears that he only wants to be with me and these have been the happiest times of his life besides when he can feel me in pain. He is doing everything right putting me and our marriage first. But i am struggling with this lie. It makes me wonder if there are more lies and it just makes it twice as hard. I am so saddened and lonely. I honestly thought we were moving to a really good place and i feel like that has been taken away from me. I am a hopeful and optimistic person by nature. That is probably how i ended up in a relationship with someone having two affairs. I see the best in people. And now i hate being someone who overthinks, questions and second guesses everything. And it is so heartbreaking since i thought we had made some major progress individually and together. And now i feel like he is dismissing this lie and saying it is not something we should let us got caught up in. <br /><br />Thanks for listening!Hopeful 30noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7026450255174007652.post-27545298344004381192015-08-14T12:57:09.427-04:002015-08-14T12:57:09.427-04:00A shimmer of hope ... as we lay in bed last night ...A shimmer of hope ... as we lay in bed last night falling asleep H reaches over strokes my hair for a moment and says. Im sorry ... so sorry ... does this lessen my hurt no but i think it puts mini bandaids on my wounded heart and im appreciative to hear that wo asking ... small steps right.Woundednoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7026450255174007652.post-37534065782415450692015-08-14T04:42:43.431-04:002015-08-14T04:42:43.431-04:00Anon Aug 11,
I had the same fear as you, that if...Anon Aug 11, <br /><br />I had the same fear as you, that if I didn't get "over" this, my rapidly cycling mood swings and unending questions about "why" (i didn't give a crap about why with HER) that i was going to chase his ass right out the door. <br /><br />I had read the timeline of 3 to 5 years to regain trust and something resembling a "normal" life. And i used to scream it--"THREE TO FIVE YEARS, CAN YOU DEAL WITH THIS FOR THREE TO FIVE YEARS??" <br /><br />well, the mood swings did calm down but what helped a lot me was HIS patience. <br /> <br />Honestly, I cannot remember a time that he turned me down when I needed to talk, or denied me access to his devices or any of his accounts anywhere--phone, bank, shopping, the works. <br /><br />You will be numb at times, you will be cold at times, and you will feel the warmth of the blurry light you can see at the end of the tunnel; and my belief is, if he works with you, he will not go through the worst with you, which is RIGHT NOW and then suddenly leave. <br /> That's my experience. <br />You can't rush through this, if you do you will leave many stones that you need to upturned, in your life, his life and your relationship. <br /><br />You are not crazy, btw, you are entirely normal, which doesn't make it easier. Just know you are not alone.<br /><br />A note to all anonymous-es Use the drop down "comment as" box below, it's near the bottom of the list and choose "name/url". <br />Give yourself a name so we know you.<br /> You do NOT need to enter a URL. Steamnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7026450255174007652.post-15775984059275983202015-08-14T00:37:11.801-04:002015-08-14T00:37:11.801-04:00Perfect response is perfect, Dandelion.
I don'...Perfect response is perfect, Dandelion.<br /><br />I don't suppose I'm interested in forgiving her...she has no desire for it and I don't think I have it in me. She's exceedingly cruel and unpredictable, so i think the best I can hope for is to not allow her to have any hold over me. I can simply (in my mind) wish her no ill will and be done with her. <br /><br />Hugs right back at you! It sounds to me like your head is on straight...you just have to your heart time to catch up!Dananoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7026450255174007652.post-9636905879549108592015-08-13T22:07:27.026-04:002015-08-13T22:07:27.026-04:00Beautiful, RT! If only those who are thinking of ...Beautiful, RT! If only those who are thinking of cheating could read something like this and get a brief glimpse of the disaster that affairs bring when they are discovered.Dandelionnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7026450255174007652.post-63186659403873617392015-08-13T21:47:34.639-04:002015-08-13T21:47:34.639-04:00Random, just beautiful. Thank you.Random, just beautiful. Thank you.Melissahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15625911085419338023noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7026450255174007652.post-59159015243714547822015-08-13T17:43:31.704-04:002015-08-13T17:43:31.704-04:00Anom August 12th,
I'm 20 months from D day a...Anom August 12th, <br /><br />I'm 20 months from D day and can tell you it will get better. Your mind is normal, you just received an unexpected knock out blow which rattled everything you thought in your mind to be true. Healing is a process for you personally and for both of you in your marriage. You can't rush it, speed it up or just get rid of it. When something bad happens it just takes time to understand it. Betrayals are so complicated, so many emotions, so many reason why, why not, excuses, truths, lies, knowledge, unknowns etc... It just takes time. I tried a thousands ways to rush the process but none of worked but time and a new evolving marriage is on your side. Don't be hard on yourself, you didn't have the affair. My mind movies are almost gone but my husband still has his personal hell - the guilt and shame doesn't heal itself away. For him, he has the scarlet letter forever, he will forever be a cheater. I don't care if he evers forgives himself. Not my problem. Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17219895095283341385noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7026450255174007652.post-48530715946797381562015-08-13T10:42:46.566-04:002015-08-13T10:42:46.566-04:00Dana,
You raised a question of whether it's em...Dana,<br />You raised a question of whether it's emotionally or spiritually ok to hate the OW. This is an issue I struggle with pretty regularly. Just when I feel like I'm moving forward, I take three steps backward. I can only give you my opinion and add to that I struggle to follow through with what I think is right. <br />I think it's reasonable to assume that you will hate her for a time, especially if she continues to contact you. She sounds awful. But is it possible that hating her forever is unhealthy for you emotionally? I kept telling myself over and over that I needed to forgive the OW in my situation until my therapist said, "Why do you have to forgive her? Forgiveness is the 'gold standard'. Why don't you just shoot for not letting her matter to you?" That took a little pressure off of me. I've also started reading "How Can I Forgive You?" which addresses acceptance as a means of forgiveness, particularly in instances where the offender is not remorseful. It also talks about seeing the offender as a human being. This is where I struggle. I want to believe the OW is a monster, but, frankly, I don't know much about her except for what her behavior was during the affair. She sounds damaged but I don't know whether she has experienced trauma that caused it. <br />I think you hit on something important when you mentioned the background of the OW in your situation. She is clearly damaged and, as you said, you can feel some empathy for her background. If harboring hatred toward her is hurting you more than her, then it might be better for you to find a method that helps you to not continue to be affected by her. Maybe the first step is you seeing her for the broken person that she is and it sounds like you are already there. It's not excusing her behavior, it's just not letting the hatred toward her eat away at you.<br />Now, if only I could follow my own advice... ;-)<br />I'm sorry for what you are going through.<br />Hugs!Dandelionnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7026450255174007652.post-86923029914921074872015-08-13T10:23:42.342-04:002015-08-13T10:23:42.342-04:00Thank you Lili - it's always good to hear some...Thank you Lili - it's always good to hear someone gets it. My hubby has been much more loving of late. He is coming back to himself. Interesting point ... he grew a beard months ago after DDay ... to the point of long and unruly ... as he said, "to hide my face." He shaved it off on way back from trip with his dad. Upon our reunion this week he was almost giddy with joy that he at least felt able to show his face. And with this step toward self forgivenes he is more able to show his love for me ... you cannot truly love another, without loving yourself first.Melissahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15625911085419338023noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7026450255174007652.post-20298211367852278912015-08-13T07:22:21.998-04:002015-08-13T07:22:21.998-04:00I'm taking advice found on this blog to deal w...I'm taking advice found on this blog to deal with 'mind movies' . I have my elastic band and snap it when thoughts enter that lead to panic attacks begin. Then I get busy. House work art gardening anything to keep my mind occupied! Doesn't always work but is helping!Theresahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11767712425596090138noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7026450255174007652.post-4399323957076363582015-08-13T01:24:05.245-04:002015-08-13T01:24:05.245-04:00I recently posted this on craigslist...the site my...I recently posted this on craigslist...the site my husband used to find his AP. I don't know why, it just made me feel better...<br /><br /><br /> <br />Remember me...<br /><br />Before you continue down this path, stop and think of me. <br /><br />ME: I'm the woman to whom you pledged your love and honor. I'm the woman who stood by your side for so mamy years, the mother of your children. I've been there through the good times and bad. I loved you when you didn't love yourself. <br /><br />YOU: You are that amazing man that I have put on a pedestal so high that it will surely kill us both if you fall. If you continue down this path you will place a label on yourself that you will never be able to remove. <br /><br />We all get lost, we all need reassurance. Don't do this. Instead, turn to me. Tell me you are hurting and lost. Let me help you. <br /><br />If you do this, when I find out, and we always find out because the other woman won't let it remain a secret, our life as we know it will end. You will lose everything, trust, your marriage, the respect of your children, the man you always wanted to be. Don't do this. We can save each other. I'm right here and maybe I'm just as lost as you. Turn around and save us both. <br /><br />Remember me.random thoughtsnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7026450255174007652.post-52194372054812477082015-08-12T10:02:16.599-04:002015-08-12T10:02:16.599-04:00I've been stalking this blog since April when ...I've been stalking this blog since April when my husband of 21 years confessed to an affair. It happened in 2013 and he ended it in December of that year. This was with a "work acquaintance" that lives in a city where he had a meeting every other month. Those are the only times he was with her - a total of six times. He never fabricated a story to go see her or be with her. He was only with her during these meetings. He has had no contact with her since December 2013. Since he has confessed to this betrayal, our marriage has never been better. We are closer, more intimate, communicating, acknowledging the problems and poor behaviors that led to his choices. We are calling this our "second marriage." He is truly committed to me and our marriage and is filled with remorse and guilt for what he did. He told me he doesn't even think about her at all. He says he never loved her, always loved me, was never going to leave me - was all about sex for him. He said he did kind of "care" about her, but nothing more than that. It's totally over for him. Totally. So, you say, what's the problem? It's my stupid mind. I can't quit thinking about her and them. Images, thoughts, all the time -- it's driving me crazy. I can't even look at other women at the grocery store without thinking "oh maybe she looked like that" and then picturing her with him and then my mind totally runs away with me. Panic attacks have become "normal" for me. He loves me through them - knowing something has triggered my behavior. And, I know it hurts him that he knows he's the cause of it. How long will it take for me to quit hanging on to these thoughts? It's only been four months - which feels like an eternity, but maybe it's not in the world of healing... Everything is so good with us - we are healing, restoring our marriage, happy and in love again... except for my stupid brain... Please tell me this part will go away... Please tell me how to make it go away... (PS - I am so thankful for all the posts on this blog - the advice and words - It's helped so much. So sad to be in this club, but thankful for your words that have guided me through this journey.) Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com