Wednesday, July 13, 2016

Wednesday Word Hug


68 comments:

  1. I had a conversation with my h last night over the telephone as we are living separately at the moment following his recent d day.. I tried to put how he had hurt me into words.. It's so hard trying to explain but I said it was like being in a car crash... The scars are not visible but the pain hurts every inch of my body ...

    I'm dealing with the pain the hurt as best as I can... My husband can't seem to help me with my pain because he's hurting too... It's mad isn't it?? He fffing caused all this... I am trying to be compassionate however, giving him some time to get himself together so he can hopefully help me heal.. Answer some unanswered questions honestly.. He's giving me very little at the moment so rather than pushing for more and hurting myself im gonna give us some more breathing space... It's been 10 weeks since I found out he's been back in touch with ow so very early days.. There is no rush right now so I'm going to try enjoy life without my h presence in the house... : ) I do miss him at times : (

    Xxx


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    1. The scars of our past may not dictate where we're going but the ones from far ago can return with a vengeance and interfere with the scars of present! I'm so thankful to be past the worst part of my scars hurting me from early childhood memories to the most recent betrayal of my best friend and husband. I'm thankful that I have a remorseful spouse that literally is becoming a better man for all the mistakes he made in those years. I'm thankful for this blog and all the wonderful ladies I have met here even though I hate what brings us all here!

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    2. SamA
      I'm so sorry you are doing the dday two blues! I have to say though, I'm proud of you for your strength in living apart until he gets his priorities straight! I literally thought I would go crazy the six months we were still being contacted by the cow. I just couldn't understand why not hurting her feelings was so important to my dumbass h until I realized that he was afraid of her and what she may have done to me when he was traveling out of town! I can't imagine the hurt I would have if I found out he ever contacts her again. I'm so sorry you have one of those that appears lost in the fog. I'm hoping more therapy will help your h with his fog! Sending you hugs!

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    3. SamA,
      It's why I often urge women on this site to tend to themselves and their own healing. At first, even the most remorseful partner often can't help us because, if they had their shit together, they wouldn't have cheated in the first place. It takes time (and therapy!) for them to really understand what was driving their behaviour. In the meantime, we feel emotionally abandoned, routinely let down by their inability to understand us, frustrated by their defensiveness. Best to just take some time to do triage on ourselves.

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    4. Spot on Elle, true words if ever I heard them... Thank you my love xxx

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  2. Hi Sam. I do feel for you Sam its the worse feeling in the world. The scars are deep but they do start to heal slowly. We are both in our sixties and really wanted it to work. He left for 6 months. We still have our bad times a year after but its getting better all the time. I suppose its a case of deciding what you both want. At least he told you that he had been in touch with the OW.?? What next

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  3. Of course you do Sam. You know I am reading a book about sex addiction serial cheating. Never held a place for this before but the recommend a single mc session together and then sepetate counseling AND LIVING apart for a while. Because this is not a marital problem. It's HIS problem I cannot remember if this is your husbands only AP or if there were more. But this is the first time I've read anything like this and I am shocked that I once again did the right thing (kick him out, not talking) on discovery

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  4. Steam as far as I aware this is the only ap, however the fact he's been back for a second time in my opinion warrants a separation.. . I need the space to think and so does he.. It feels like he's in the fog and I understand that.. This is different from the 1st d day i knew then I could give him a second chance now I'm not so sure.. Like you steam this is all very alien to me.. I'm learning everyday, walking the unknown finding my way through the dark.. Steam how are you getting on? Any more contact? When do you think you'll be able to see your h face to face and what has your therapist suggested. Your doing so so well in the circumstances and you should be so bloody proud of yourself..

    You ladies amaze me daily look how very compassionate strong and understanding we are, I doubt men would be so understanding if the shoe was on the other foot.

    Jilly55 he actually didn't tell me I found out and I backed him into a corner till he spilled some of the beans.. I've yet to get a full disclosure.
    I wish I knew what was next jilly I need to continue with the separation untill I'm certain of what I want, untill I'm sure she is out of the picture totally, until my anger subsides so I can make a decision whilst I'm on stable ground..my anger has gotten the better of me these last few days to the point of me becoming violent towards him which I'm not proud of and certainly havn't felt the need to do before, I am going to speak to my counsellor tomorrow I hate who I've become... I'm hoping that violent point was my turning point to a better place where I can start to heal.. Fingers crossed.. Xxx love to you ladies

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    1. SamA
      I so understand how you feel about hating what this experience has made you become. I was so angry with my h that when the rage came out I was screaming insults and during one of the worst tongue lashes my h said stop hitting me and I said I'm not hitting you and he said it feels like it. That shut me down for that one time. My rage came out after many months of trying to get the truth out of him and I don't think I have ever been as hurt and angry in my life. Once I felt like I had spit out all of my anger feeling at him and he kept telling me he understands how hurt I was then we began to get to the better place for us! Don't be so hard on yourself and just the fact that you don't like you at the moment means you can work on that for yourself. I'm still a work in progress but the realization that I didn't like me was really what turned the corner for me! Take it one day at a time! That's all anyone can do! Hugs!

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    2. SamA,
      I think you're doing everything right, in that you're taking care of what you need and drawing really clear boundaries. You know you can't control him but you can control you...which you're doing.

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  5. From the beginning on dday 1 I told my husband that the pain felt more intense since it is all internalized. And honestly once dday came all of the unknown from our marriage especially the affair years made sense. I had never understood our conversations. The gaslighting and making me feel like I was the crazy one. For me I felt like the scars, pain, and injuries ran so deep. I feel like this pain is even deeper due to societies perspective on betrayal. I have chosen to keep it between us and only share with my therapist and my husband has told no one. I know that is my choice but I felt really no one in my life is equipped to help me in a positive way with this. I have found myself over this year at times feeling bad for myself. And I would never want to be in this situation but there are no visible scars with the exception of weight loss and a more distant personality/less trusting of everyone. I had a friend who was diagnosed with cancer and I found myself struggling to be helpful and close. Of course she cannot help her situation. But if I brought up mine I know many people would question the part I had. Yet more than ever I believe it was him, his problems, his decisions. I never gave up, was always present, always probing for ways to improve our marriage and family. He was the one making me feel like less of person so he could do what he wanted. I still have resentment related to all of this. It still hurts. In the end the one person who you thought had your back was stabbing you in the back. So hard.

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    1. So hard indeed. And yes, I think our reluctance to be candid about our partners infidelity contributes to our isolation. Our culture is so unforgiving in its response to infidelity. Trump is hosting a night dedicated to Bill Clinton's affairs at the RNC. It's insane. HRC didn't cheat...but she's having her feet held to the fire because she stayed with him. THAT's her crime, according to so many. No wonder we stay silent. It's insulting and infuriating.

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    2. Elle, I had not heard that yet. But you are exactly right. This election and so many aspects of our culture perpetuate this thinking. Tv shows, movies, tabloid magazines. No one ever really knows what is going on in any person, marriage or family. I am dreading this as I know trump will not stop at anything. I find it disgusting that him of all people is doing this to her. The way he treats women. Take her down regarding the issues but that will not happen. Ugh.

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    3. I often think about what she's endured. Love her or hate her, she's handled with incredible grace having her husband's dirty laundry aired for years. And to have everything she's worked her whole life for reduced to her marriage... And yes, the fact that, at the moment, the biggest critic of her husband's infidelity is a serial cheater himself. Well, it's hard not to choke on the hypocrisy. This isn't about politics but about the role that infidelity plays in popular culture...and our response to it.

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  6. Hi to my sisters. My first attempt at IC was a bust...therapist was WAY too kind to my H and couldn't get past my comment about my marriage being so much better now...but at what cost???I am still trying to get thru the anger phase of this, among all the other feelings. At any rate, 2 months since first attempt with therapist and I am trying another one. I want to go into this with my eyes wide open. What kinds of questions would be good for me to ask to get a "read" on this person? I am coming up on my 1st D-day antiversary. I'd prefer not to have a big setback as that is how I felt with the first attempt at therapy. Thank God for all of you...I am sure I wouldn't have made it this far without you❤️ Aka Farmwife

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    1. Farmwife,
      You'll be hard-pressed to find a therapist who'll come out, guns blazing, to your husband. For one thing, it's likely that approach would simply shut your husband down. He needs to also feel as though this is a safe space for him to express his feelings. If you're looking for someone to effectively discipline him for cheating, you won't have much luck in therapy.
      I wonder if you should focus, for now, on finding a therapist who can help you work through that anger before you bring your husband/marriage into therapy. Of course, you're angry. And a therapist who's a good fit for you will understand that...but also encourage you to explore what's behind that anger. Anger is an expression of a feeling. What's the feeling itself? Fear? Sadness?
      I would also ask any potential therapist what her experience is with working with betrayed wives. What approach does she take? Does she understand the trauma model as it pertains to infidelity? It can take time to find the "right" therapist. But you might want to give it more than one visit (unless it's VERY clear the therapist is wrong for you). It can take time to really determine if it's a fit and a few sessions can help.
      Hang in there, Farmwife. A year in is progress. Yay!! You survived the worst of it. Now's time to move past that anger so that you can really address the pain behind it, which is tough but ultimately feels really good.

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    2. Thanks Elle. This is Indivifual therapy for me. He isn't a part of this yet. I'm trying to work on the anger by going to a therapist buT the last one made me feel like I should go home and hug my H becuz our marriage is so much better now and he was afraid...that was why there was 8 months of TT. After listening to that shit for 5 sessions I really felt like it was setting me back tremendously. Especially after before one session one of the whores tried to contact him again and he was going to handle it his usual way..."ignore it" and that obv hadn't worked. I texted her and told her to quit trying to contact him and the therapist told me " I didn't give him enough of a chance to handle it on his own" I told her he had been "handling it" for weeks and she still wasn't getting the message and I was sick of him "ignoring" her and thinking it was going away. She just kept saying to me " you didn't give him a chance to handle it his own way." WTF Now I am gun shy but ready to try therapy. again but I want to go into it with eyes wide opened instead of swollen from tears. Thank you Elle, I appreciate your suggestions and will use them next week at my apt. ❤️ Farmwife

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    3. Farmwife,
      yeah...sounds like she wasn't the right fit. Her focus needs to be on you. That won't mean that he/she won't sometimes call you out if your own actions/thoughts aren't ultimately leading you where you want to go...but it does mean that you should feel like she's entirely in your corner.
      Don't give up. A good therapist is, literally, a life changer. Worth the effort to find her/him.

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    4. Farm wife,

      I wanted to share what worked for me. I went to therapy alone. My husband is a psychologist so he does marital and individual therapy for his living among other work. So he did not feel comfortable going to therapy or a need. That is whole other story.

      My husband suggested I got to therapy since my choice has been to not share this with anyone. After dday 2 I was a mess and beside myself. I was much worse off than dday 1 that took place 5 months earlier. I knew I wanted someone who was liscenced, a social worker or lcsw. I wanted someone who had experience and who was not just starting out. I wanted someone who was pro marriage since many are not and especially push women to leave their husband or significant others. I had decided by this point that I personally wanted to do everything possible to preserve our marriage and family so that was good for me. Of course I wanted someone if I choose to exit that can help me too but not push towards that. I searched websites and found someone right away that was my obvious choice. He had the right type of experience and all he does is marital therapy and has a major focus on betrayal. I can say from what my husband does that they do not get specific training in this area. It is covered by the never had classes on marital therapy. And I know he does a wide variety of work so I knew I wanted someone who this was their specialty. I did not want them experimenting or learning along with me. I also chose to leave my area and I drive 1 1/2 hours each way to see my therapist. The main reason is I did not want to see anyone in or around where we live since it is my husband's field. The other reason is I wanted who I felt was the best and knowing everyone around here no one could compete with who I chose. It was worth it going that far. Initially he would see me for a double appointment to save on drive time and to work through the background and the hardest phase.

      For me I obviously had the reason that my husband was not coming with me to therapy but in the end it was a great benefit for me. I felt like it was all for me and my time and thoughts and feelings. After this all came out there was and is a lot of resentment that I always do and give my all yet get the short end of the stick. So it was good to go and only focus on me. He was great and so supportive. He was the perfect fit. And I loved how we would talk about whatever I needed. I would journal and take notes on the other weeks when i did not have an appointment that would help me to determine what I needed to discuss. He helped me through seeing that I was the reasonable one. With my husband I feel it can be hard since he has all this professional experience. And you would not believe some of the things he has said to me even recently. But it helps that I can talk with a professional then I am more confident and feel validated that I am thinking logically and with societal norms. It has helped me to be less emotional also when talking with my husband. And he has really helped me look out for me and protect myself.

      Best of luck and look hard to find the right person.

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  7. Fragments of HopeJuly 13, 2016 at 2:27 PM

    Steam, that is really interesting. I didn't want to throw him out at the time because I didn't not want him to continue to be passive and feel like things were happening to him or that I made him leave. If he wanted to leave and break up our family and hurt the kids then let him take responsibility for it. I know a temporary, considered separation (not just in the heat of the moment) is a different story but I have not shared details with the kids and would have had to tell them something. However I think a separation would have really helped to get myself back, over 2 years later I haven't really done that. I hope the space helps you.

    Sam A, we can really feel your pain and shock at this new D-day (I had a second 9 mths later, I could have killed him). You are doing the right thing giving yourself space I think, under these circumstances to restore your equilibrium somewhat.

    Teresa, I know what you mean about old scars. It brings them right to the surface again. My associative brain loves to find all these connections and relive old hurts! Aarrgh. Maybe this is a chance to process those too. I can still feel the affair hurt so close under the surface and it doesn't take much to set off the volcano!

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    1. Fragments, I think those of us with kids don't always have the option to separate. I let my husband stay (though he fully expected me to kick him out) because I didn't want to destabilize my kids' home unless I knew it was permanent. To have a dad coming and going seemed like it would cause too much grief...and frankly, I didn't have the emotional energy to help three kids cope with their own pain and confusion.
      As for old scars, I maintain that a silver lining (for lack of a better term) of betrayal is to unearth long-ago scars that come back to haunt us. I thought I'd healed from my mom's addictions...but my husband's affairs brought up so many of those long ago hurts. The fear of abandonment, the fear that I wasn't worth being faithful to (or quitting drinking for)... By re-addressing those (and I don't doubt they're continue to come up, though less severely), I feel lighter and free-er. If there's a volcano, it might be because there's a whole lot of long-ago pain right there, ready to blow.

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  8. Hey friends, I haven't commented in a while, but have been ghosting around the site, reading, wishing you all support and healing and taking comfort. I have felt envious of the folks whose husbands have had moments of clarity and recommitted to the marriage or at least agreed to work in a committed way. (I know this isn't fair and I am not in any way minimizing the anguish, hurt, pain of betrayal. Just wish my h was willing to give us an honest try). My d day was Jan 1. Two weeks later they "ended" it, no contact. Shortly thereafter resumed contact and although he has been trying to figure out what he wants, has been ambivalent, unsure, penduluming back and forth. Last month things came to a head when he disclosed that he was going to see her on a business trip that coincided with her birthday. (she lives several states away - thank God). Just wow. I told him then that he probably needed to move out. Finally found my boundaries I guess and realized I had been an enabler for 5 months. We've agreed to a constructive separation which begins in August. I gave him time to find a place and we will manage how this is presented to our kids (17 and 13). Such a mess, but we are both scared and he admits to being a little afraid of losing me at least. I think this separation will be a big reality check for him. And some healing space for him. He has, in recent weeks, begun to talk about this thing that's going on as all about him and as a much larger problem/mid life crisis. Trying not too feel too hopeful that this puts him on a path to realize the affair is a symptom of the problem and not a solution to it. I am scared but take some hope in seeing others who have been or are in a similar boat. The separation will be for six months to start. During that time I will be taking care of me (I've lost 45 lbs, love strength training, take painting classes now and have become a meditation junkie.) and spending time with my "tribe" my growing network of amazing ladies. I will be talking to a lawyer, not because I plan on taking action, but just so I know what things might look like if we don't end up together. Some days I panic and some days I am convinced that we will end up together. He's just such a mess right now and knows this is about his crap. He sees a counselor. I see my own and we see a couple person too. I'm hoping this time will help him sort it out and get him to a place where he will at least give us an honest chance with her out of the picture.

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    1. Still Standing
      I can hear the trepidation in your writing about this separation. But, I need to say, from this side, you sound incredible. Full of resolve, aware of the positive changes you've made in your life, taking full responsibility for yourself in terms of your finances and your family. Whether or not this turns out how you'd like, I have no doubt that you're going to emerge from it absolutely fine. Whether he can manage the same remains to be seen. But I'm so glad you recognize this is HIS problem and there's nothing you can do about it. Focus on self-care. And kudos to you for treating yourself with the kindness and self-respect that you deserve. Please keep us posted. I suspect we could all learn from how you're handling this.

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    2. I must sound better when I write than I actually feel. I am terrified, but know this is the next right step. I'm a fighter not a survivor but sometimes I feel so needy and lonely and tired and hurt, hurt, hurt by the rejection and just want someone to make it better. I'm lucky to have a sister who is super supportive and doesn't get annoyed when I text her 800 times a day for support or reassurance or to talk through the latest crazy thing and over analyze it to death looking for a shred of hope. Good days and bad days, but definitely working on me. This separation will be time for me to heal and reclaim some parts of my home where there are demons or where I felt erased. And time for me to reconnect with the self I lost all the years being subsumed into mommyhood and making everyone one but me happy and not asking for or getting what I needed. Learning to be kind and compassionate with myself exactly where I am today (thanks Pema Chodron). I read and devour books on all subjects related looking for insight and answers and hope. All I know is that it is not over yet and even though it is hard and it hurts there is something really good between us that is worth fighting for. His old shit has really come to a head. He's even said "I'm sorry you married a time bomb." He's really choosing this time to work on him and I am OK with that. I just wish the OW wasn't in the picture to complicate things. When she was out, he was all kinds of ready to "build a new mosaic from the broken pieces" (that's a quote btw) but I think affairs are like addiction. You read that so many places and that is why they fall off the wagon, even when they don't want to. How much harder then, when they are not sure what they want and the gaping hole inside them that led to the affair is still there. Despite the ambivalence in him, we are communicating and cooperating better. He's shifted from "I don't love you" to "I love you but I'm not in love with you." and telling me i'm his best friend. I want to shake him because that is what grown up love it. Do we need to work on the romance? Um yes. But he's so distracted by this shiny, forbidden love that he can't see what is in front of him. But as I've said, we've come a long way since dday and he's not even talked to a lawyer, didn't want to take a lease for a whole 12 months and talked them down to 8. Not th actions of a man who is hell bent on divorce or only doing lip service to trying to figure it out. I say this to comfort myself, but I think there is some reality to it as well. Ultimately, I need to get on with my life and taking care of me, making my space and time as awesome as I can imagine. Maybe the better guy will show up. I'm still hoping. For now.

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    3. Still Standing-
      You have figured out something that has taken me 2 years to do. You are on the right track even if it is fraught with pain and fear.
      Keeping walking down your self healing path and if you get stuck, reach out to us.

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    4. Thanks MBS, I am afraid. Afraid of what he will use all his extra time for. Afraid of running the house and figuring out a budget on my own (embarrassed to admit this). Afraid of divorce. And just tired, but trying to hang in all the same.

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    5. I am stuffed with dread today. We are drawing close to the time to announce our planned separation. We will tell his mom first. Our situation is complicated by the fact that she lives with us. We built a suite on to our house starting 3 years ago and she moved in rather than go to a retirement village etc. This is one of several inciting events in my opinion. She is very sweet and wants to feel useful but also sucks at boundaries and is very emotionally demanding and manipulative. All without realizing it. Really has become enmeshed in our lives to the point where I didn't feel part of a couple any more. Much the same for my h, I'd guess. I've been working hard to establish boundaries but she tends to blast right through. Example, out of the blue she comes up to me and says you guys are really going to have to work on your sex life to save this marriage. I responded with "This is not your business and I am not comfortable discussing this with you." Another example, she insists on making my kids (13 and 17) give her hugs. I've told her repeatedly that my kids are allowed to say no to physical affection if they don't want it. It is their body and you do them no good by forcing it. You only teach them that they may not have boundaries with you and by extension other adults. She just doesn't get it and plows ahead anyway or dismisses. I also get that I have a lot of displaced resentment with her right now. So long storyy short, we are telling her about the separation on Weds. We will be giving her ajob to to of being upbeat and supportive to the kids. (Since she will still be living here wit me and my H will be moving out - effed up I know). But I still anticipate several days of emotional flailing. She will likely spend an entire day in bed. Then I spent two days on a nice trip I had planned with my daughter, but when we come back we have the family meeting and drop the bomb. My daughter 17 knows about my Hs affair and was told by my h about wanting a divorce before xmas and before he even told me, because he was doing that drunk cheating medicating thing and flailing around and barfed it out one night when she challenged him on his increased drinking. What a mess. So she is going to be even more angry than she already is. I'm going to have to hide her car keys. Does anyone have any advice for discussing separation with older kids? Besides its not your fault, this is about us and we love you. I'm not sure what else to tell them. I don't know how I am not going to cry. I know this is what we need to do. He has lived so far without any real consequences for his actions, even if he thinks he has. Shit is about to get very real. Meanwhile, he has foud a place out in the woods and is playing at making up his bachelor pad. Took me out to see it (which I thouhgt was both weird and sweet at the same time - still inviting me in even as he is looking for space). Bought a big rope for a rope swing, having fun thinking about furnishing it. Just really insensitive and more fantasy, if you ask me. it will be a lot less fun next Sunday. So we tell the kids, he is around for a week. Then the kids an I go for a family vacation to Maine and he moves out. Yikes.

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    6. Still Standing,
      Honour that fear and hurt. Those are legitimate feelings and hardly surprising given all you're going through. I don't think, with kids the ages of yours, that you need to be all strong and full of resolve. I think you can show them the pain and anguish involved. That grown up love is messy but that you can still handle it with self-respect and dignity. Your MIL clearly never got that memo. As for her manipulation (I ran into this exact thing with my MIL -- the forced hugs -- I would give your kids the permission to say no. No big deal, just a "no thanks granny" and then move on). She can't be trusted to honour your/their feelings and boundaries on this. But that's an aside.
      As for your husband, he seems pretty confused about his own boundaries. Showing you his "bachelor pad" with some excitement seems really insensitive to me. No real insight into how painful this is for YOU. He seems in touch with his own feelings...but not so much yours.
      However, maybe I'm misreading.
      Still Standing, your sister is your saviour. I envy you that relationship. And she will remind you daily that YOU are worth fighting for yourself.
      Let yourself feel the pain and anxiety and confusion. They won't last forever. Each day will bring you closer to some clarity and healing.
      Hang in there, SS.

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    7. Thank you, just what I needed to hear. Feeling much less attached and invested in any specific outcome today. And a little angry. Probably a good place to be. Big day ahead. Announcing the separation to my MIL. I'm hoping she will surprise me, but preparing for some heavy flailing.

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    8. Quick update. Conversation with my MIL went really as well as can be. I fully underestimated her. She's very supportive of the decision to separate. So nice to know I can count on her instead of protect myself from her flailing. Our next hurdle is the kids on Sunday. Thanks for listening.

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    9. SS,
      I'm glad she surprised you pleasantly but I would caution against a wholesale embrace of this new version of her. Keep your boundaries up. Practice sticking up for yourself.
      And good luck with the kids. I hope that goes better than you expect too. Kids are incredibly resilient and when they see parents able to treat each other respectfully, I think that goes a long way toward helping them cope. Allow them their feelings, of course. Sadness, disappointment, fear. I know you'll assure them that they are loved and safe and able to love both their parents equally. Good luck, SS. We're thinking of you.

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  9. Sam and FOH my therapist, who was our therapist backs me up in not wanting to see him. She (who also did not know that he was an SA and remember her asking and looking at him and me looking at him when he answered "no I dont think Im a sex addict--I agreed!) she didnt think he was a sex addict, and all she can really go by was his behaviour and answers. He did not disclose all of his behaviour to either of us, and he straight up lied about it (not at all uncommon int he sex addict--they have a TREMENDOUS fear and a HUGE amount of shame). She told me to work on me while he works on him and I am fine with that. I honestly have TOO much going on, but it's ok. first two weeks were awful. AWFUL but i got it down to a routine. I'm reading books (I am going to add my latest "living with a sex addict from crisis to recovery" VERY straightforward book, but again, only deals with sex addiction, not a "normal" and horrible affair. so I do three 12 step meetings a week and see my shrink and I journal and read a LOT, and also make time for fun and to try to go out with a friend once a week. I am on anti depressants now which just give me enough clarity to focus on me--I'm not high, I'm not euphoric, I'm just able to do what I need to do. He did me a huge favor when he came to the house when I was not home and offered to bring home ice cream but he'd already left. I was feeling really good, but it would not have been the best thing to do, it was just very spontaneous.
    Farmwife. Elle will have better advice than i do but make sure you are not SLAPPED with the label of co-dependency. I do 12 step because I like the people and the process, but I refuse to be labeled Co anything to something I did not know existed. Make sure they understand that this was HIS choice (although you both may have "left space" for it to happen), but being 10000 percent trusting as most of us are--who would expect this from our best friend? our life mates? See if they understand that what you are going through is a TRAUMA which can lead to PTSD and that you CAN rebuild a marriage or create a new one from the foundation up after an affair. Good luck to you.

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    1. I fought hard against that co-dependency label. How the hell could I have been a co-dependent when I didn't even know what a sex addict WAS let alone that I was living with one.
      However, with the clarity of hindsight, I can see that while I might not have been a full-blown co-dependent, I certainly allowed behaviour that was unhealthy for both of us and for our marriage. I overlooked things, let things go because I was too tired to argue, took on the role of martyr ("fine, I'll do it then...") because I got some weird self-esteem from feeling superior to him. So....yeah...kinda co-dependent in that I didn't make him fully accountable to our family.
      Not saying that a therapist should be insisting anybody is anything. That's not their role. Their role is to help you see your place in the relationship. Not to accept blame...but to recognize. HE is always responsible for his choice to cheat. But it's the rare marriage that didn't have some unhealthy dynamic where at least one of the partners (usually both) felt silenced or unvalued.

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    2. So interesting as my therapist said that my husband treated me as if I was codependent yet he said I seem like the least codpenedet patient he has ever had. He really feels like it is my husband's personality and career that allowed him to behave the way he did. It is a little hard for him as he has never met my husband but I think I am pretty honest and have presented things pretty factually or from both sides. It troubles me at times how he feels about my husband. He feels he had had an amazing transformation and had continued it for so long yet my therapist seems unsettled still. I think he is skeptical of him. I think if anything it has shed light on who I am. I always knew I was very independent but I took it to an entirely new level. I hit a really low point during this all but luckily he took a long trip out of town and I realized even then it was him and not me. I was still puzzled about what was going on. He would go warm and cold. Now it all makes sense.

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    3. Elle
      The co-dependency label was attached to us by his ow. She virtually screamed at us via text that we didn't love each other we were co-dependent on each other and that was why we would never be honest with each other and our marriage would fail! I'm not sure what she thought she could accomplish by her continued contact but the reality is it forced my h to admit how unstable she had become. I was just sick of her trying to get between us and I knew we would never move forward with her anywhere in our lives. Four months of not having to deal with her has done us as a couple worlds of good! I was the first in our relationship to admit that I knew we had issues and part of the problem was living in the separate houses that we own. Other than that I feel the rest of the blame belongs to him, he decided that night to go on a date that didn't include me and then he brought her back for sex. I have allowed him to own that blame and one of our early conversations was about selfish people and did I think of him as selfish. It took a while for me to let him know that while I don't think he's a selfish person, the decision to go on that date was a very selfish decision as well as having the affair!

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  10. Thank you Theresa, I'm pretty sure we have a crazy ow on our hands although I've not had the pleasure of meeting her yet, maybe that's to come ... She def has a way of getting her way back into our lives and my h needs to find out why this has happened again.. I really hope he works it out in counselling as I really can't move forward unless she's completely out of sight and mind.. His choice his decisions I suppose I can only control what I do right now and that's ensuring I don't go round to the ow and give her what for, as much as I'd like to I am not going to give her any more attention then this silly bitch deserves.. I hate her for what she's done and him equally for being part of it .. Xxx

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  11. Sam A. I have noticed a pattern through reading about the ladies experiences and affairs in general. Like your H my H told me the affair was finished BUT carried on contact when the dust had settled. They dont seem to be able to give it up and like you 15 months later i find out they are still in contact. I called her husband and once that happened she wasn't interested in my H it was a big problem and it threatened her marriage to a wealthy guy so that was the end of it. He also sounds like he is in the fog where they don't really seem to know what the hell they are doing they dont seem to be able to end the friendship/relationship and want to ruin everything for it !!! Its so hard to understand so painful to think that they would put someone else before you lie to you to keep in touch with this alien person !! You are not alone Sam i am feeling for you its such an awful time. I hope and pray he will come to his senses xx

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    1. Jilly55,
      That's one of the reasons why I think married affair partners should always be outed to their spouse. It can remove them from YOUR marriage...but also I think the other spouse deserves to know what HIS wife is doing.
      Affairs are intoxicating, which is why, once the drama of disclosure or discovery settles down, if the cheater isn't doing work to really understand WHY he cheated, he's vulnerable to getting back into the affair. It makes him feel excited, alive, sexy, interesting. Far more fun to spend time planning meetings, etc. than deal with a devastated wife making demands. That's why these guys who want us to "move past" the affair without really examining the impact and the reasons behind it always make me nervous. They aren't interested in changing...

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    2. Its like they are all following the same damn playbook or script. It really seems to me that the theories that affairs work like additions, truly makes sense. How else can you explain the behavior. They need their next self esteem fix. And that is why boundaries and tough love are needed. That and a well timed kick. (Ok not really violence, but sometimes it feels good to think about).

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    3. Elle,
      This is something I keep pondering....I have kept quiet about the affair to the OW's spouse.....It's been a year and four months since the affair started (ended four months later) and I have always been afraid of retaliation by the OW and her spouse (against my husband) She was a co-worker (subordinate position) and I worry about allegations made of up sexual harassment. Am I just afraid? Or am I justified in keeping quiet. I would love to have her outed to her spouse, but I worry about the ramifications for my husband's job and my life. There has been no contact for since October (even professionally) but I worry as there are upcoming conferences and things they both have to attend. Would appreciate your thoughts on this!
      -Morgan

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    4. Morgan,
      It's so hard to know whether there would be negative ramifications. Depends, frankly, on how unhinged both the OW and her spouse are. I guess I should avoid saying "alway" re. outing the cheater to his/her partner because you don''t want to make your own life more difficult.
      Given that your husband still has to work with her, it might be best to stay mum. I really don't know what to advise... :(

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    5. Morgan, I was in the same situation. The OW was a co-worker of my husband. She has since left. She did not work for him directly but it's a small company. I opted not to tell her husband for several reasons. I had no way of knowing how her husband word react. He might go crazy and confront my husband at the office or worse, show up at our home. I'm fully aware that I acted out of character when I found out, so it's reasonable to assume he might too. We have two young children and I'm not willing to risk exposing them to that. The OW has three children of her own. Her youngest is about the age of my oldest. So there are three more innocent people who would potentially be affected. And not knowing what the OW's reaction might be to being found out, I had to think about what she might do to cause more damage. Throw in the fact that her sister threatened both my husband and me post d-day and it's clear they are a little trashier than what I'm used to dealing with.
      I contemplated doing something anonymous, but I suspect her husband would ultimately know who my husband is.
      I feel for her husband as I suspect she's never come clean. They've been married somewhere in the vicinity of 20 years. I believe firmly that be deserves to know. I'm just more concerned with my the well-being of my family than hers, so I've said nothing.
      Not really advice, just perspective from someone who's been in a similar situation.

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    6. I am in the same boat Morgan. My husband had an affair with a married coworker when we lived in another state. He still works for the same company, just on another site. This woman rents an apartment where we used to live and her husband and home are in yet another state. She gave my husband a sob story about how she wants a divorce, but doesn't want him getting her money... or some junk like that. But really online I searched her name and found where she and her husband just completed their "dream home." A large part of me wants to tell her husband (she also was with other guys from work because she told my husband about it to make him jealous - gag!) so I feel he deserves to know, but I don't want to worry about our safety or worry about my husband's job security (I stay home with our two young children). I know deep down I mainly want to tell the husband so that she will have consequences for the affair and maybe have to deal with a pain similar to mine. Because I know that she didn't care about my husband at all, but just liked the ego stroke of having a guy 15 years younger than her interested in her. She probably never thinks about us anymore.

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    7. Thank you Elle, Dandelion and Grace! For now, I think I will continue to keep quiet. I like the thought of deciding to worry more about the well-being of my own family than hers. I would hate to have to start worrying about retaliation and always looking over my shoulder.
      -Morgan

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  12. Thank you so much jilly... I appreciate your kind words they give me hope xxx

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  13. Coming up on my one-year anniversary of discovering the text messages that proved my husband's affair. It's this coming Sunday. Any tips from our veterans further along the healing process for how to prepare for this day? Part of me is dreading it because I know the memories of that night will be vivid, but another part of me practically wants to celebrate. It will mean my husband, finally, after 11 years of dating and marriage, has been faithful to me completely (no other women, no internet flirting, no porn) for an entire year! My husband looked at me like I was insane when I mentioned how I felt. I think he is so ashamed that he has only given me one year of faithfulness in all that time. What have others done to prepare for or mark their antiversaries?

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    1. Grace - so glad you have asked this as I wanted to ask the same, as I approach the first of 2 anniversaries. The first being the day he left and the second 3 weeks later when I discovered the affair. We have just returned from a family holiday, so there are many positive steps but whilst we were away it was what would have been our wedding anniversary...spent in tears (both of us) and me shouting and being angry. Hoping for advice on how to deal on these other big ones coming up.

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    2. Grace, Beach girl here jumping in with my 2 cents. My one year post D-Day was June 14. I felt and continue to feel the same way you do regarding one year of fidelity after 37 years of marriage. Porn and sex addiction were grandfathered into my marriage and the first fling my spouse had was two years after we married. I told him that as far as I was concerned he married me under false pretense and never had any intention of being faithful. This is complicated to say the least and I hope my feelings soften and change over time. I still can't imagine celebrating our "real" wedding anniversary as that date means very little to me at the moment. This causes him great emotional pain and I seriously do not care. We did nothing to celebrate our anniversary this year and I don't foresee doing anything next year either. That day has become a non-event day in my heart. Things have leveled out in my life and I am still a work in progress. I know that if he has a slip or relapse or whatever the hell the professionals call it, our marriage is over. I just won't live with someone who can't stay away from porn or prostitutes. I try not to think about the "what if's" much because that is where I fall into a dark hole that is deep and wide. I try to stay focused on the moment. The passing of that day was awful for me. I cried all day and still have those days.They are slowing down. I now melt down every 7-10 days instead of more often. My thoughts still get hijacked and honestly I do not think I can watch any of the political stuff because my heart aches for Hillary. That moron Trump deserves a heart attack in front of a live camera for throwing her husbands behavior in her face. Seriously? I know my husband has to face what he did and how he lived his life based on the terrible things that happened to him as a child and the choices he made to comfort himself when there were no loving adults to give him what he needed. I can't change that. He can't change me either and although I am still here and working toward a new life with him, our marriage clock was reset on D-day and the original day is nothing more than a day in my life. Hang in there. Nobody understands how difficult it is for us to make some kind of sense of our new reality. Make it what you need it to be and I will celebrate the one year sobriety with you my sacred sister. Love and Peace, Beach Girl

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    3. Grace,

      I found the one day anniversary to dday was not a bad thing. My husband knew it was coming up but had no idea of the exact date. We had gotten to a really good place so it was a good time for us. He was working really hard in so many ways. For me I found it was a good time of reflection even leading up to the dday anniversary. I just was overwhelmed with how far we had come and how different our life was from one year ago. It was really great. For me I am struggling more with this summer. I know it is when my husband's first affair started on a guys trip right before our second child was born. Her birthday is coming up which is hard for me. Then dday 2 anniversary is coming up which is a lot more difficult for me. And looking back at last year I have a lot of resentment of how he lied to me all summer. Nothing with the ow but trickle truth and making me feel like I was crazy when I knew all along he was holding back critical details. We went to a wedding and had some major discussions then the next week went on our anniversary trip and that is when he dumped everything on me. So the next six weeks coming up are hard for me. I am trying to take it a day at a time and appreciate the good things.

      I will say that I am thankful this all came out. My husband's decisions were horrible but I am glad he finally was honest with me and himself. I was confused and did not understand why things were the way there were for so long. But getting answers helped me personally to be in a better place. Of course it has been really hard but I am thankful it came out. And if we can continue to have the marriage we have now and continue I feel so lucky. This is what I try to focus on.

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    4. Hi Grace,
      I hope that however you marked the day, you felt strong and proud of your survival. I made our one-year anti-versary a day of being together. It was before Christmas and we spent the day shopping for both sides of our families, had a long lunch together and basically helped each other through, grateful that we were still a family. Not an easy day but ended up being a really important one I think.
      However people choose to mark the day, I think what matters is that YOU set the agenda based on your honest feelings.

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    5. It ended up being a pretty good day. Nothing outstanding, but there was no crying, no meltdowns, and I held my tongue a few times when I could have made him feel horrible. At the end of the night before bed he thanked me for staying with him and for giving him a chance to show me that he could be the husband I have always deserved. I think choosing to see the positive in the day really helped. Instead of picturing last year and the text messages and remembering that horrible first weekend, I instead focused on all the changes from last year - all the progress he has made to figure himself out, that he has stayed committed to regular counseling for almost a year now, that he has not given in to temptation to look at porn, that he is even being honest enough to tell me when he has been tempting is HUGE! We're not out of the woods yet (especially with our actual wedding anniversary and the anniversary of the physical affair coming up next month), but I can feel gratitude that my marriage is not filled with lies anymore and that my husband is doing his best to make up for lost time.

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    6. Grace and all, it has been so good for me to read your stories. I know that I harbor much deep pain to still have such strong negative feelings around our wedding anniversary and his betrayals. As much as I want a magic bullet, there is none. Just hearing the word "prostitute" sends me in a tailspin. Does anyone else get that gut response? How do I stop that? My mind is spiraling down today and is filled with those ugly pictures in my head of my spouse and his addiction. He has been "clean" for 14 months. When will it every been long enough? Thoughts? Feeling pretty fragile at the moment.

      Beach Girl

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    7. Beach Girl
      My number one trigger is the word ' volleyball'. That is where my h met his ow and I have tried work hard to get past that trigger. I'm still trying! As the Olympic events get under way O will struggle for the first time since I first started watching the sport. I know it doesn't have the same affect on my h and I know he's missing his favorite pastime but I don't know if time will ever allow me to enjoy the sport again! I can't imagine the world of dealing with a sex addict! I'm always a bit fragile but finding my strength! Hugs!

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    8. There are cognitive behavioural techniques that can help you associate new thoughts with old triggers, which might be worth giving a try. Our minds are powerful...and pliable...and we can use that to our advantage. None of this is easy, my dear BWC warriors. But we are stronger than we know.

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  14. I'm learning so much on this thread. There are so many of us in the same boat & that alone makes me feel so much better.

    My h continued contact past dday1 (Oct 2014)...but it was different. He says. It was like an addiction he couldn't stop--emotional. Looking for the "love & acceptance" he found in the affair . He said he never found it again with her after dday1; but he was in such anguish, depression, self loathing (all things leading up to affair) & she kept making herself SO available--he just kept looking for it. Talking to her outside the store, lead to private talking in her store, & culminating in a sexual episode 8 months past dday1 (June 2015) that he says he did to feel pain & ruin himself. He was in IC this whole time & was getting that the feelings weren't "her," but still he was chasing it, which made for more self-loathing....

    When I asked why bother saying he wanted to stay with me in the first place, he said cause he ultimately wanted me, our family, loved me & also wanted to help me with my pain...he just couldn't (apparently).

    Since I found out about all this continued contact a few months ago, I'm so confused. But its also SO apparent that this is HIS dysfunction. And any shred of guilt & blame I was holding onto is gone. We have been separated for a few weeks. He's out of the house 5 nights & me out 2. Our 5 kids stay put. We explained it as a "timeout," which they seemed to get. I am strong enough to deal with their emotions now.

    We text, see each other, have a family day, sex even....it's so weird. But the thought of him coming back & me having to wonder if he's lying everyday again makes me anxious. He wants back desperately & is doing whatever i need. I don't want to do this as a punishment. But, i just feel some sort of control now that I had lost being lied to for 20 months. I can't stay in this limbo forever, though. Cause I really miss the relationship we had built up--that I thought we had built on openness--for the past year... I struggle feeling that it was all lies. How can I trust someone again who can lie so well & so long??

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    1. Queen B, I'm so sorry for what you are going through and kind of feel right there with you. I keep rereading your second paragraph, trying to see my own h in there because maybe it is a step toward his own wake up or me hoping the affair is losing some of its appeal. I'm so glad he realized that what he wants is you and the family but you absolutely take all the time you need to figure out if it is worth staying or not, what is right for you at this point. Take one day at a time and trust your gut. Much love.

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    2. Queen B,
      I echo Still Standing's advice.. Day at a time. Right now, you need this feeling of control to re-establish your sense of safety. As long as youre both honest about your feelings and you expectations, carry on. At a certain point, you'll either want more...or you won''t. Or he might decide he can't continue like this. But don't force feelings that aren't there yet.

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  15. Elle, you have such great points about the "co" label, I realize I let myself slide into the exhaustion which left me no time to really deal with something that did not feel right. Part of me gathers "intel" for a period of time and does not want to discuss every little detail as it comes up, but I will do that in the future. I just think there needs to be a better term than "co"-for this kind of behaviour
    In one of the Sexual addiction programs you are labeled a "co ADDICT" what? I don't think so!!
    I know people who are "co dependency in action" (ahem--cough, my MIL), but I digress. People who are constantly and blatantly trying to control everything and everyone around them, nose constantly where it does not belong, and stirring up drama where there is little to be had. They THRIVE on Drama. I dont. that shit wears me OUT!!

    my nose was in the right place. This is/was my MARRIAGE and my favorite example of trying to feel safe in it post D-day comes from the book "your sexually addicted spouse". Someone who has been carjacked will always check the back seat--and because of that trauma, they may always check. Many of us check anyway!!. NO one who has been carjacked and now checks would be called "codependent" That's all we spouses are trying to do--the same thing--feel and stay safe!!

    Hopeful: My shrink also does not think of me as very 'codependant" and she saw both my H and i for a full year and now sees me alone. She LOVES the 12 step programs and loves that I go and is relieved to know that those of us who go do not have to identify as "co dependent" anymore

    Queen B it's shocking that "anguish, depression, self loathing" is SUCH a common thread with these cheaters. It's so common it's crazy. It should be proof to US that this has nothing to DO with us, it's all wrapped up in their self worth (which is often pretty low, unless they are narcissists)


    And Finally Grace, the only way I knew to go through it was just to go through it, let the feelings come and if you don't fight them, they wont be fighting back at you all day. My first Anti-versary was sad, I was sad, although we had come so far (he fell off the wagon just DAYS after it) I did not wallow in it, We had plans for something and i dont remember what, but we went through with them, nothing too taxing and we didnt talk much about it as I felt pretty healed.
    My 2nd, anti-versary I swear to you, I hardly noticed, there was another crisis in my life that got all the attention. It's always time that does its things. And a repentant H works wonders too. So I can't help with that unrepentant thing--up to 6 weeks ago I could have, I thought I had a full repentant H, who had just gotten cranky about life.

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    1. I have been thinking about all of this a lot. And my husband and I had a long discussion that made me think even more. For him it seemed so obvious that things were so bad and that they are 180 degree different now but as I told him for me it was not that way. I would notice if something was off and I would bring it up but there was always an excuse or turn the tale on me and it was my issue or fault. For me as I told my therapist it is hard for me to even consider that codependent label or any part of this when I was lied to for 10+ years. When I had the person I was supposed to trust most tell me I had the issue. And for me I have the layer of my husband being a psychologist so I have always felt like his words carry more meaning. He hates I say this to him but he always has been somewhat athoratiative in his opinions. He does not see it that way but he has stood his ground on things that go against everything I have read or heard from my therapist. And he has gotten upset in the past when I say so if I was a patient in your office this is what you would say about her husband's porn use if I described your behavior to you. There really is no answer he can give. And he usually can cite some person, study etc since you can find anything to back up an opinion, but I stick with it and cite all of the "experts" I have read. I have copies ready to hand him.

      So I guess in the end it just gets back to what we say that it is their issue and problems that led to this. I am not perfect but I cannot work with or help someone or be held responsible for anything when I was lied to and had secrets kept from me. I confronted my husband about the possibility of other women and he always said no way. He would tell me about his friends if they were too close, dancing with another woman, kissing another woman and how bad that was. It is hard going through this and for me the highs and lows of this process is exhausting but I stick with it every day.

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    2. Same Hopeful ... something was off .. not right or didnt add up but i was crazy? Paranoid or accusing of nonesense ... not so! Nope when he spilled the beans initially it was like a rapid fire of connect the dots ... ah ha and you motherfucker! The trickled truth and fall back in months after dday was a bitch and wasted time and did damage but once he gave me 75% maybe even 90% truth or more a,story that made sense we could start rebuilding and it is not as bad as initially but still dealing for sure!!! now 14mo out now that i am pulling myself together and even having good days i see my H is struggling? Well he may have been all along i was too wrapped up in me to deal with him .. as of late he tells me hes sorry hes thankful and he was dumb hes trying to put into words the lies he told to me to himself and how its all stupid ... recently he said hes disgusted with himself feels not worthy of me pur family and hes down right mad and sad he did this ... i know this is his shit i do but i always want to help ... not pacify or ok by any means i told him sit w it process why .. why not or what he can would have done different. Be thankful and show it ... never to late to be who you want to be right? But when he has these down days it sometimes affects me, us, i know tye fact hes even talking about it is progress... i think. How do you guys handle this? I know his doing his shit his mess ... but i also think alone can be lonely we all know and while i dont sugar coat it i also think sometimes you have to tuen inward to not be outward where a wall could form .. been there. Dont want that all in all i just try to stay in the present ..

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    3. Wounded,

      Exactly it is hard to see them struggle. I mean it is his issues but he helped me through the worst of it and is still helping me. It is hard though to know how to help. My husband has this sunny demeanor and says he has never been happier. He feels like life is so good and as long as we are in it together we will be good. He tells me he loves me always and forever. It is sweet but I cringe. I thought I would want to hear it but I have said to him do not say it unless you really mean it. He is almost offended. But 16 months ago I had to hear he was not in love with me but would always love me because of what he had in our past. And he was not sure what he wanted or was capable of. It is hard to see how he has changed. It is good but hard how can he be the same person? And at one point he changed to be the cheater. He was not always that way.

      My husband does say he thinks about it every day. He said his biggest wish is for me to be happy and eventually trust him. Some days I am not sure I can be fully happy (at least with us) or ever totally trust him. And how do I get there. He is doing everything. When I talk about it he says it causes so much pain in him. I feel like it is going to take a lot of time. The changing of the habits and his feelings seem very solid and boundaries are in good shape. But who is he and how could he do what he did. Early on he kept repeating that he had done irrepairble damage and he should have just left me so I could start over and find someone I deserve. I feel bad since sometimes I wonder if that would be better. Can he ever face what he has done and truly heal beyond making changes but true healing? I do not have the answers. I have told my husband I can only be the person who I am. I am the same person he met over 25 years ago. I have not changed and my core and I promised myself I will be true to me. I am not sure he has that in him. He says he is there and living a transparent life and an authentic one and if feels great but has he dealt with it all I am not sure.

      I say for you wounded make sure you are there for him. Have you seen a therapist alone or together. Also for me reading books has helped. My husband has been really slow and he says that is so hard but it has helped him see a new perspective.

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    4. Sweeties
      I cringe when I read a text that says that 'I love you more now than ever '! Makes me think WTF, how did you feel for the past 30+ years! Maybe this should be posted on the shit they say post! Just SMH! Hugging all of us close!

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    5. Wounded,
      I didn't try to help my husband, I'm not a therapist. He would call the therapist and schedule a session. At near one of our last sessions she told him, you are just now seeing, these are the consequences of your actions. I was in no shape to help him. I tried not to be negative when he was in these moods. I tried not to accuse. I tried to be nice for a day. That is all I had to give for about 20 months.

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    6. For us one thing that worked well was following many of Gottman's tips and suggestions. I do not remember the exact language. My husband was familiar with their work and brought it up.Here is the article he sent me. http://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2014/06/happily-ever-after/372573/ What stood out to him was the part about bids and making an effort at connection. For him it was an ah ha moment. He had dismissed anything I found interesting or valued. It was too boring, too much work.... This article really helped him start to see what he could do and a little bit each day. And after a while he really started talking about how love is a verb and it requires effort and action. I know it is hard when someone is down but at least for my husband by making these daily efforts it helped him shift away from all the bad and negative feelings he had for so many years. He just told me today he hated to have the bathroom light on in the am since he hated looking at himself in the mirror. All I ever heard was him snap at me to turn it off. I mean I had no idea that was the cause. But it is so simple and what an insight into him.

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  16. I just wrote quite a lengthy post and I do believe I lost it! Since it is about 415 in the morning, I am going back to sleep LOL
    Night ladies.

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  17. My husband was so remorseful after d day one it's almost like we helped each other along. He was great
    This time he was so sick of himself. So sad. So unworthy that I was sick of HIM. A WIZE FRIEND reminded me that he should feel way for sick about what he did to ME and not go hide in s corner licking his wounds. The world did NOT revolve around him. So I reminded him to mAN UP. GET HELP. Years ago after a big fight-- we were only dating. I left. He didn't call for three days. So I called him and asked if he was an idiot for letting me go. In the end his fear of rejection kept him from calling me. I get it it's fine rhat he felt sorry for himself. THEN Geez. I told him this time he had to FIGHT for himself and FIGHT for me. I'm not asking him back. Although I hold the cards he has to play his hand. I want to see that hand!!!! And no matter what. He HAS to keep working ion himself (and I myself) no more of him sitting there too sorry to move And feeling too sorry for himself to make a move. Man the hell up!!!

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    1. That is a great realization. I agree we really helped each other a lot through phases and it has made us closer. I also feel like it was important for my husband to help me to see how painful it has been. After about a year he has really opened up to me and done work on himself and I can see the pain. Honestly when he brings something up without me having to ask him even if it is about the affairs or ow I am so happy. For him to take the initiative and confront it with him it means so much. I think it is so easy for people that compartmentalize to just repress what they are feeling and hide from the depth of the pain they have caused someone. I think in a way that is what got them to that point. And in the end we each are in control of ourselves which was a hard reality to face.

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    2. Hopeful 30
      The ability to compartmentaliz basically is how my h was able to cope with the ow and keep us a totally separate section of his life. It took me months of reading and research on this to finally understand how the affair started and why it took so long for it to end. My h didn't understand my need to know that much detail about his affair but for me to be able to believe that he really does love us and wants our future better, I first had to understand how it started and what steps he had taken to end it. I couldn't believe all that he did. First he built a fence for my lab, she sat on my porch at the time crying how is a fence going to fix your marriage? Then he bought me a car big enough for my dog to travel in, again she crying how does a car fix the marriage but he kept telling her that I was moving in the house with him and it was over for them. She backed off but only for a short period of time and because of her history of wanting to end her life, my h continued their emotional connection up and to the last time he went to her apartment to connect her internet and she attempted to kiss him but he rejected her! Within two weeks of his ignoring her text and phone calls she blew up my phone and world with the truth about the affair. God that feels like a life time ago and it is only a couple of years. This is what has worked wonders for me. Just finally understanding the dynamics of it all! Still mind boggling but at least now I feel like I have a better handle on how to keep moving forward! Hugs!

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