Separating or Divorcing? Page 5

54 comments:

  1. Hey its a fresh page! So I've been writing out my story because I've been meaning to for a long time. There's so much I want to share and so much background. And I've been reading Brene Brown again and her stuff on how speaking shame, telling your story, takes away some of it's power. So I have been writing a bunch and working on my story. I want to share some of it here, but it might be really triggering for some folks. I've also got my own blog (!!) but as of right now, I am the only visitor, lol. So it's just 100% weird with lots of poetry and swearing. But also I just did a little piece on infidelity (based on my recent comment in the you don't want to go back post) and have directed any poor souls who land there, to come here. So I'm wondering, is it Ok for me to post my story here when it is all done? Its going to be a whole giant lot. Maybe I cna do a short version here (the cliff notes) and the full thing at my own blog. Thing is, I have stuff I have been wrestling with sharing but feel ready to share, but I want to do it here with the folks who have seen and known me the longest. What do you think?

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    1. SS, I'd love to hear your story and I'd love to read your blog. I suspect we are all wrestling with hard things so thanks for the heads up. I have days when life itself is a trigger.....

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    2. SS please do post your story even if you have to do several posts broken up - I read Brene's most recent book too and I agree with you - I have felt shame for so many months, but it's really not our shame to bear, it's CH shame. I just posted my convoluted story on the "The Power of BWC" post a few days ago to respond to Gabby. For some reason none of the posts on here trigger me - it's things outside of this blog that do. Here it is healing.

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  2. I'd love you to share your story here ss, when your ready xx

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  3. SS - I, like all the women here, have your back on this one. We all have a story to tell, and yes, the telling can be a release and on the road to healing.
    Hugs
    Gabby xo

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    1. I would love to read your story, too, but I think "Cliff notes" here and full vetsion on blog might work better. I usually access the BWC blog at night on my smartphone (tiny screen, tricky to scroll). I save links, names of authors, videos etc to my email so that I can check them out in more detail on my computer during the day. That's just my personal preference though- other readers/ contributors may feel differently!
      Looking forward to your story in whatever firm it appears.

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  4. Hi ladies. Long time no comment. Yes SS please share stories are our life line!!!!

    Love Becky

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  5. I also have some things to share. You all may remember that my H and I have been separated now for 10 months. I have done a lot of hard work and was consulting a lawyer and moving towards ending a unhealthy relationship that was very very decayed/dead. When the worst happened..... my H fell asleep driving and had a terrible car accident! I was altered by the police to come to the ER in the middle of the night and have spent the last 3 days in a fog of doctors nurses specialists surgeries etc .... at the ICU. We have passed over some big hurdles and things are trending in the right direction. And I am very lucky to have both his family and my family here and we are all supportive of each other.

    But the OW is rearing her head and it has been so so hard and painful!! She has been texting me begging to see him and say he wants her there that they are together and love each other that I am aweful for blocking her. I am just keeping him under my control. All the horrible things. She even tired to gain access to the ICU and one of the doctors took me aside and said "a young girl was here claiming to be your husbands girlfriend". I almost died!! Luckily he sent her away recognizing she was not part of our family. Anyway....ahhhh. I have tried so hard to not respond and be calm (although I give her a few swats via text). She is only 22 and has no clue on life..... ahhhh. This has just been so hard and this interaction has brought back so many of the mind movies and fears ect. From the early days.

    This has been quite the curve ball when I thought I was starting to see what the next chapter would be for myself.

    Love and support sisters
    Becky

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    1. Oh Becky, what an ordeal. I think you are doing good by acting as the reasonable adult in the difficult situation you find yourself in now. I would not allow the OW in his hospital room either. Sending you thoughts of support.

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    2. Oh Becky, I don't know that I can add anything beyond what Phoenix says below. Be proud of yourself for handling this situation with dignity and class. what an awful, awful thing. And to have the OW show up... well there really is no bound to the selfishness and cluelessness, is there? I can't believe she has the gall to text you directly and to show up at the hospital. How mortifying for you and the doctor. This 22 year old child is so broken. Of course this is bringing up the past panic and mind movies, because the triggers are right in your face.
      I'm so sorry and so angry on your behalf. What a mess.
      I'm thinking of you and sending strength your way. Your squad here has your back. Does family know and can you enlist their help to shield you from this girl? Or at the very least can they stand with you when you have to deal with her? You don't have to handle all of this alone and I'm glad to hear you've got family around you. What about your H? I'm not sure what level of communication you had before the accident or if he is in any shape to make decisions. Is it possible it wasn't an accident? Mine certainly had suicidal ideation throughout his affair. Just sliding that out there out of concern.
      I wish I could be there to hug you and punch the stupid OW in the neck. Or at least glare at her intimidatingly if she tries to talk to you. All your sisters are standing with you. Just close your eyes and picture that. Many hugs!!!

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    3. Thank you sisters. I needed this dose of support from the sisters who really understand. Both families know about the affair and no one supports it or cares 2 cents about the OW, but there a lot of different ideas about what it means to give support to me and while they are good intentions none of them actually feel that supportive.... which was why I reached out here and why I am keeping an appointment with my therapist tomorrow.

      It has been a painful scary hard week. With tons of conflicting feelings. I am trying to be very present and not add suffering to the pain by being my head too much!!!

      I will know that army of sisters are with me. Love and support sisters
      Becky

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    4. Oh Becky, my heart is reaching out to yours. It is difficult to imagine this young woman with no boundaries thinking she has any rights to be present in your lives at a time like this. Depending on how long your spouse is hospitalized you may need a restraining order to keep her at bay. Like SS just said, all your sisters are standing with you. Close your eyes and picture your silent army with open arms, ready to hold you in a safe place.

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    5. Becky
      I reiterate all that has been said. Thinking of you and sending you supportive hugs. Love to you
      Hugs xo
      Gabby

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    6. Becky how are you today? I cannot even FATHOM this. How is your husband? Maybe she'd like to take on his bathroom issues. Real life has a way of weeding out the weak

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  6. Becky, what an ordeal! I know you have to be there for your H at this time, because you are a good and loyal person, but what a lot of conflicted feelings you must have right now. And of course you have a childliish, selfish OW thinking only of herself. I'm so sorry that you are having to deal with that trauma, on top of everything else. I'm glad you have a support system, but damn. What an awful turn of events.
    I devoutly hope that his recovery will continue to progress, so that you can get out of crisis mode and make some decisions that are good for you. And so that you can get some distance from the toxic OW situation. I'm thinking of you and sending you hugs. Keep us posted, please!
    SS, you are a gifted and intuitive writer, and I would like to read what you've written.

    I had a bit of a breakdown last week. I found texts between my daughters and the skank. They were planning a birthday party for the ex together. The texts were happy and perky, and they even traded "love you" comments. Friends, my heart cracked wide open. The pain was intense. I cried for hours. I felt unbelievable hatred for her, and for my ex. I felt betrayed by my own children, which was horribly unfair to them, of course. My old depression monsters began to get hold of me. I wanted to die. I knew I couldn't, but I wanted to.
    Eventually I got my equilibrium back. I managed NOT to say anything to my girls. I did get my ex on the phone. I did some cursing and crying and yelling. I told him that I had been more than reasonable about the girls seeing her in their dad's presence, but that I DID NOT WANT THAT WOMAN TEXTING WITH MY CHILDREN. He agreed.

    I still get sad and angry when I let my mind go there, but I'm feeling better. I'm doing a play, and still seeing a sweet guy. Eventually I'm afraid I will have to take this up with the girls. I pray that God will give me the wisdom to do it in a way that doesn't hurt them.
    Hugs to my sisters!

    Phoenix



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    1. Phoenix thanks for the encouragement about doing my post (s) about my story. Its going to be long and some parts will be difficult, but I think it will be good to do what Brene Brown says and own my story.

      The happy perky love you comments must have been a knife to your heart. O my god I can't even imagine. I would be feeling like "not only did this bitch steal my husband now she's trying to steal my girls." Eff that.
      I can so understand all the emotional places this has taken you. And of course, you recognized right away that your girls are not betraying you. Little people are so soft and adaptable, they are just doing what they think they need to do to make everyone happy. They have no idea who this woman is or what she's really done.
      I'm glad you are still here. The world is a better place with you in it. I'm glad you found your feet, you are strong. It just gets old sometimes doesn't it?
      I'm glad you stood up for that boundary of no texting. Im glad you are doing things that feed your soul. As far as taking to your girls, take your time, try writing it out first? That often works for me.
      Sending you hugs and strength too.
      Much love! SS

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    2. Dearest Phoenix
      OMG, I think that would send pretty much all of us into a breakdown moment!! I am sure you reading those texts was aweful and I am so so sorry that the OW has that contact with your children. I know your girls are so precious to you and I hope and pray that your H will be respectful and work with you on boundaries for this issue that feel right for you!!!!

      I love though that you described your heart breaking wide open!!! I thought YES our hearts have to break open, we can't close down, lock out, or gloss over this pain!! Cracked wide open is the only way to come through all this wholeheartedly!!! Phoenix I think our ddays were at a similar time and your courage and grace and faith have been such an inspiration to me!! I think you are amazing. Continue on with your courage and heart sister, I am right behind you!!

      Love Becky

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    3. Oh Phoenix
      I feel so much for you after reading this. The damn cheek of this bitch! What an absolute horrible thing she is, to not only have your husband, but worm her way in with YOUR children. Credit to you for keeping things so civil with your children dealing with this thing. You have amazing strength. I know if it was me, I probably would have lost it.

      I hope you don't mind me sharing this. Part of the reason I took my h back is I never wanted my kids to have to deal with a bitch/whore my husband hooked up with if we stayed separated and divorced. Even if in time it was someone who had nothing to do with the initial affairs and even if we ended up divorced. I don't have much in life. My children are my world and that would probably break me. When my father hooked up with this whore, I was young and didn't understand, and was taught respect elders etc...As soon as I became a teenager/adult and learnt what went on - I no longer had a moment with my fathers whore, which I'd only met a few times when I was young. I very rarely see them, but as an adult I would not betray my mum one inch and to me if I was being nice, talking to my fathers whore -that would be betraying my mum. My mum never said a bad word about this time in her life when I was growing up and even though I am nice to most people in life - I have no intention to be nice to people like this. How can you be nice to people who intentionally hurt you just to make themselves feel good? I hear it often how it's said to heal and move on you have to forgive etc. Nope. I don't think I can forgive - ever. I know I have so much anger and disbelief in me for how we have been treated, but I feel if I forgive - I've given in and it's accepted, perhaps like letting h off the hook (as Elle has posted about 8 June). Sorry for the ramble - I just had to talk to you as I know you would understand. Phoenix. You are in my thoughts.
      Hugs
      Gabby xo

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    4. Thank you, Gabby. Your mother must be a very lovely person, with more self-control than I. I wish I could have kept all negativity out of my reactions, and I'm doing better, but....I definitely let negative things slip sometimes. Then I feel terrible, and I try to reinforce to my kids that they don't have to choose. Of course, I want them to take my side, as you have your mother's, but I know that at their age, their father's opinion is so important to them. So I try to be understanding. But it is very hard. Only you and the others here really understand how hard. I have struggled with the idea of forgiveness a lot. At first I was sure I would eventually forgive. Then I became less sure. Now I just don't know. When I think of the sheer selfishness it takes to pretend that a marriage and a person just don't MATTER....and how do you forgive someone who has never expressed an ounce of regret? Who does not even acknowledge that wrong has been done to you? I don't know. Like you, I still struggle with so much resentment. I know that the resentment and anger hurt me - and sometimes my kids - more than they hurt the guilty ones. But I'm still working on how to let it go.
      Hugs to you, Gabby! May we one day find peace.

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    5. Phoenix, sorry to be coming to this conversation so late. I can't imagine how awful that must have felt. And I bow to your grace you showed.
      You did the right thing by dealing with this via your husband and reiterating your boundaries around this.
      I had a good friend go through this and I remember her wailing "the woman who broke up my son's family is going to be the one reading him bedtime stories!!!!". It was excruciating for her.
      Today, she's remarried and her son has two half-brothers and my friend feels like she's right where she belongs. Painful absolutely. But maybe not wrong.
      It's the hardest thing in the world, I think. To be there for our children, to put their well-being ahead of our righteous fury. But that's what we're called to do. And to model self-respect, which you're doing.
      You're beginning to soar, Phoenix.

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  7. Becky I'm so sorry for all your going through, hope your h makes a full recovery. Everything happens for a reason and in time you'll see what that reason is.. stay strong and remember to look after yourself in and amongst everything that is going on .. big hugs dear xxx

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  8. Sending hugs to each and every one of you. Sending strength to make it through the day, hour by hour. This site makes me realize I can and will get through what I didn't think I could. I am so glad to know there is a safe place to come when I need it.

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  9. SS, you summed up my thoughts very well. And my language! Bitch, indeed, and finally getting what she's wanted all along - to be me, to have my family. A knife to to heart, yes. Thank you for your words and encouragement. You are right about my babies; they want to please everyone. Especially their dad. I get it. I'm taking this one day at a time. Sometimes it feels like I'm living in a nightmare. Other times, I feel like maybe I can stand it. I can't imagine the future right now. At this point, I feel like I am so much more healthy and healed where my ex is concerned. I don't miss him or want him back. He has caused me so much heartache, and I have attained so much distance, that I have really been able to leave those feelings behind. But the mess he has made of our kids' finances, and the permanent tie between my kids and the skank, with her child, are still holding me back and causing me stress and pain on a daily basis. I resent him and the skank so much, that they have fixed it so that most of my torment now comes through my own children. It is hideous. I struggle with depression, but I still find joy in my daily life. There are many things to be thankful for, if only I can get past some of these feelings. I hope you are moving forward too, and I look forward to reading more about your journey.
    Feeling Lost, I'm glad you find hope and comfort here. It has been such a solace to me, a place to vent, to share ups and downs - and to truly be understood. Hugs!
    Becky, yes,, our stories had a similar time frame and ran parallel for a while. I also found encouragement and strength through reading your posts. I know we have to suffer to get through. I know our hearts have to break open to heal. Some days I handle that better than others. We have come a long way, sister. And now we are both dealing with setbacks. It feels like the waves keep rushing at us. I hope we both find a place of peace again very soon. I am worried about you, and the situation in which you are stuck. I hope he has made progress, and that you can move in a more positive direction soon. I hope you are protected from the selfishness and hurtful actions of the OW. These women are idiots. They will never see how monstrous they are, because they don't want to see. Becky, you are so strong and beautiful and loving. I hope you get to make some good decisions for yourself soon, instead of being dragged down by the bad decisions of others. Sending you hugs and prayers - update us soon!
    Stay strong, sisters! One day at a time!

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  10. Hi Sisters

    So an update - my H is still in ICU, it has been one step forward and 1/2 step back so it is slow going. We are looking to move him to some longer hospital care and then rehab. With good rehab ect. He should completely recover.

    This whole process has been exhausting and it has been really strange to be back in the role of wife after being displaced for 2 years!! Also, it has been very painful because my parents and some friends while trying to be protective of me have wanted me to distance myself or provide less support and involvement. This has been so hard because it seems like everyone is questioning and trying to undercut my position and value in my marriage. I know they don't mean it but it hurts!!

    My thoughts have been to get him out of the ICU be a friend to his family and then take the next step, which very well may be less active involvement.

    Also I kinda keep my radar up for the OW she has been mia for a while and I knind of expect her to pop up again.

    I need and nap and I'm going to take one. Love and support sisters
    Becky

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    1. Oh Becky, what an exhausting ordeal. Do take care of yourself. And please don't be afraid to tell your family on both sides exactly what you need from them. They will either step up or not, that's up to them. But you can state your needs. You can't, however, control what they think about how you're responding so do your best to just let that go. There are going to be a lot of opinions. As my mom used to say, "what other people think about me is none of my business."
      Nap. Self-care. Boundaries.

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  11. Elle , your mum sounds like a very wise lady, I love how she passed down so much wisdom .. wish in turn you pass down to us btw .. much appreciated xxx

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  12. Elle, I don't know how your friend did it. I just don't. Depression, anger, and brooding a daily thing, Don't know how to handle all these negative emotions. Having trouble sleeping. Just spent a week at the beach with my mom and kids, but it was marred by this depression. I'm obsessing and can't seem to stop. My resentment and hatred are getting worse, not better. I'm trying to be nice to the ex because I need him to repay the kids' oollege money, which he lost....but I don't know how much longer I can keep from exploding all over him. Father's Day, indeed....
    I'm sorry. I've tried to be strong but I'm losing it. Trying to keep from alarming and upsetting my mom, my kids, and the sweet guy I've been seeing, but I don't know how long I can hold it together. Pain. Rage. Obsessive thoughts. It's like stupid D-Day all over again.

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    1. Phoenix,
      I suspect there are others who would look at you and say "I don't know how she's handled this." You just do. What's the other option, right?
      Maybe you're trying to hard to handle this "right" and need to let go of that. Maybe, because you're a kind-hearted decent soul, you're pushing away the hate and trying so hard to be all Dalai Lama about it when, really, you just need to hate this situation, hate your ex, hate the idiot he cheated with. I sometimes think the more we try to not think something, the more obsessed we become. Give yourself permission to just hate what's going on. Write about it. Find your most unforgiving friend (or post here) the absolutely most vile things you can imagine about your ex and this situation. Get it all out. I used to go running and I would imagine coming home and finding the OW naked in my house. I would imagine her panicking and running out of the house. And then I would imagine getting in my car and shining my headlights on her as she ran, naked, down the road. I would imagine accelerating just enough that she thought I might run her over. I would imagine her fear. I would imagine her body jiggling as she ran. And it always (even now!) made me giggle. Am I a homicidal maniac? Nope. But I can sure think like one.
      See what you can imagine, or what characteristic of your ex is particularly annoying and that you're SOOOOO glad to be done with. And then focus on that. Until you can see nothing but whatever that is. A figure of speech? A nervous tic? A muffin top? Man boobs?
      See if giving yourself permission to be nasty makes it all a bit less of a obsession and more a part of your new life. Not a part you will ever like, but a part you can tolerate. A part that will simply become the new normal.

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  13. Phoenix. I'm sorry for the pain you are feeling. I have to post here, as I've been through a separation and at times I still feel separated!!
    I too have had a bad week, with things constantly on my mind and feelings of hatred and resentment to my h. The latest blow. H is taking his mom on an o/s trip. He did mention it to me first that he wanted to take her whilst she's able to - I was not included in this trip, not that I would go with that bitch, but when I said "what?? and what about me?" H said "you can come too". The after thought knowing damn well it would be hard for me to up and leave the kids etc. So here we are trying to heal and he's putting me second again...and that bitch of a MIL of course gladly accepted and never called to see if I would mind etc. Now I know some people would think I'm mean. Stuff them. I've had to put up with so much shit from his parents. I feel so deflated. And to top it off - I've asked for more transparency, especially with h mobile - which he will not give me. Surprise. His answer is he needs some privacy in his life and he's in contact with lots of people during the day and he doesn't want to be scrutinized over every number. No matter what I said and explained that in order for me to trust you again, I need proof. So h reckons he's not in contact with his whore, but then what's he got to hide? Yes. I have had enough, but I have done the math and to leave would be impossible. Totally stuck. I just need your support.
    PS - Despite taking care of myself, keeping busy, work, fitness - my head is in a complete dark jumbled mess. It's just shit.
    Hugs
    Gabby xo

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    1. Gabby,
      You're feeling the way you are because the situation is inherently wrong. Don't second-guess your feelings -- they are telling you that this is not okay.
      I remember a pre-marriage course we had to take (my husband was Catholic) and the instructor drawing a triangle on the chalkboard. He then proceeded to make it clear that any marriage that is a triangle (the third person is a parent, a child, an affair partner, work, addiction, etc. etc.) is not going to be healthy. A marriage is between two people and in order for it to remain healthy, it needs to be a priority for those two people.
      Your husband's invitation to his MIL, while it's perfectly understandable that eh wants to spend time with his mother while he can, was disrespectful of you and your role as his wife. This isn't about power. It's about respect. If he had come to you, told you what he wanted to do and why and then asked if you could respect his desire to do this, I suspect you might have (grudgingly) said "fine".
      Or maybe not. Either way, you were not consulted. And that's not okay.
      Are you two in counselling? This is a typical problem in lots of marriages, even those without betrayal. But our goal post-betrayal is to learn how to have a healthy marriage. And that means new behaviours. It means making ourselves uncomfortable as we figure things out.
      But you are not wrong to feel this way.
      If he wants a marriage with you, absence of cheating isn't enough. He needs to be a supportive respectful partner.

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    2. Thanks Elle
      I am in IC, h won't go back to MC, even though that was part of the condition of me taking him back, and the transparency with phone etc. was also part of the condition.
      He won't go back to MC as he said he is all about moving forward and not looking back. I know he is being disrespectful and just basically and absolute arse hole, and I know I can't make him go. So as I've said below to Sam A - I now am about to start putting into place things that will enable me to get on with life with me and my kids without him. that may take a year, or so, but hoping I can ride it out that long and in between just tune off of him and concentrate on me and my happiness. It's obvious him not wanting to be transparent is - he still has shit he's hiding. He just doesn't know how to be a decent person anymore. It's obvious he's not wanting to heal this marriage and the more I look at him the more I want to vomit and smash his ugly smug face!!! (sorry - just had to let that out)
      Hugs
      Gabby xo

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    3. Gabby,
      I also want to smash his ugly smug face on your behalf. I get so sick of the "don't look back" bullshit, the "we can't live in the past" nonsense. It's nothing more than evading responsibility for the damage he's caused. Imagine telling that to someone you hit with your car. "You can't live in the past." "You need to focus on the future." So I won't be paying for your therapy or your new legs or in any way taking responsibility for what I did.
      You're right. You can't make him go. But you can put in place consequences for not going. I'm glad you're moving forward without him. I hope you've spoken with a lawyer to determine how to ensure he doesn't drain your finances or hide anything else from you. It would be wise to draw up something of an exit plan so that when you're ready to leave, you're in the best shape possible, emotionally, physically and financially.

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    4. Hi Elle
      What consequences would you suggest for not going to counselling?
      Depending on what consequences, I know how he'll react, and I'm now trying to bide a bit of time to get some finances and me in place for an exit plan.
      Thanks
      Gabby xo

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    5. Hi Gaby, I am angry on your behalf. If a H cheated and wants to stay married he has to give up his privacy (even though that must feel like they are being treated like a child too bad). Let him know he has to give you access to his phone and to go to MC because both are your requirements of reconciliation. My H IS doing those things and even with that I still struggle with whether or not I want to stay in this marriage. I have MIL issues too (I think you & I have commiserated about them before). I can tell you if my H did that he should be worried that I would be using the time he was away with MIL to meet with my attorney...

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    6. Phoenix, you are so strong. Does your attorney know that H squandered the kids college funds? I think I would be using that important fact in a custody hearing. Is it possible that your H created a silver lining for you? That his irresponsibility regarding their education can give you more legal control over how much time the kids spend with the skank?

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    7. You get to set whatever consequences feel right for you. If staying in the marriage was reliant on him agreeing to go to counselling with you, then perhaps he moves out until he's willing to reconsider. Or perhaps he sleeps on the couch. It's not so much the specific consequences as the inevitability of them, the setting of boundaries. And of course, he's going to react. We've talked a lot on this site about counter-moves. See if you can google some posts. Whenever we set boundaries -- especially when we haven't historically done that, or we've been wimpy about it -- we will get counter-moves. Counter moves are designed to get you to back down. They might include cries of "but that's not fair" or arguments about false equivalence ("well I would never demand you give up your privacy"). They might include anger/aggression -- door slamming, name-calling, etc. They might include sulking or pouting. You likely know which counter move your husband favours because he's probably been doing it for years, every time he doesn't like what he's being asked to do or not do. So brace yourself for it. Then...set your boundary/expectation and don't back down when he responds with a counter move. "I cannot stay in this marriage if you won't agree to see a counsellor with me so we can learn how to heal from your infidelity and how to communicate in a healthy way going forward." Don't listen to his excuses, his arguments, his rationale, his pouting, or whatever. Try and remain detached while he rants and rails. And then repeat. "We need to learn how to have a healthy marriage and to move past the betrayal in a way that helps us heal. If you refuse to do that, then I cannot stay in this marriage/sleep in the same bed with you/whatever consequence you decide." And then...zip. He's deliver up a whole bunch more counter moves. Let him exhaust himself. Walk away if necessary. Go for a walk. Whatever you need. But do not back down. Decide in advance what is absolutely non-negotiable for you and then state it calmly and confidently.
      he wants you to forgive a devastating betrayal. You are simply asking him to join you in learning how to deal with it and how to have a healthy marriage. That's it. If he won't do that, he is showing you what your future with him looks like. And it looks a whole lot like the past.
      Hang in there, Gabby.

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  14. Phoenix, I am sorry for your pain. The money that is gone for your kids education is not worth the cost you are paying personally. There is an old saying that continues to pop up in my head when I obsess about money related things. My mother taught me this before she died. "If money can fix it, it isn't a problem. All the money in the world won't cure my cancer and I am going to die. I am happy that I got to see my newest grandson before I die." If your kids want to go to college they, with your help, will find a way. Please do not destroy your soul and your essence by wallowing in something you have no control over. I know this is easy for me to say but believe me, I've been dirt poor. I've had money. Having money did not protect me from my husband's behavior. Sometimes we just have to start over again and again and again. Life is not fair. You do not have to be strong. It is ok to feel angry and sad but it is only hurting you and your ability to move forward. I'm finally learning this truth. My husband has a friend who was divorced years ago and the friend's son received many thousands of dollars for his Bar Mitzvah which was earmarked for college. When it came time for college, the son found out that his own mother had raided that college fund and spent every penny. That son is now an attorney. His father helped him get loans. Oh, and that son still has a good relationship with his mother. The Dad still harbors resentment and hate for his ex-wife. It is sad. You deserve so much better. Like the truth about infidelity, you did not deserve what you got and your kids don't deserve this either. Just take it one day at a time. You deserve the sun, moon and stars. Sending them your way in hopes that you catch one or two.

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  15. Oh Dear Phoenix! Take a breath and know we are with you, know your pain and rage and how terribly unfair and hard life can be. I know it is so hard and you have a lot of responsibility, but please think of self care and set aside some time for yourself. Try journaling as place to let out your anger or so something physical,
    Kick boxing;) or walking, gardening anything really. For me mindfulness meditation was a life saver for both pain and anger!!! I think I remember you are Christian, (right?) so am I and i really love meditation. Also the Christian approach of contemplative prayer is really peaceful. Also, are you seeing a therapist or anyone? For me my therapist has been a life saver.

    Your H has made so many aweful choices that have been painful and unfair to you - I'm sorry and wish I could kick his butt and garnish his paycheck to repay the college fund. Grrrrr.

    I know the road often seems long and lonely and many times, I have thought oh.... I'm over that or this... only to have things recycle. I have to remind myself healing does take time and little by little with an open heart and staying present healing will come. Love yourself, love your girls and your mom. We are with you.

    Love and support
    Becky

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  16. Gabby it's time to take back control of this situation, you are in the drivers seat and you get to choose your next turning. Sounds like a serious conversation needs to be had, tell him what you need and if he doesn't comply he will have to face the consequences whatever they maybe. I know your h moved out for a while gabby does he still have a place elsewhere? If not use this time and space whilst he's away with his mum to think about what you want from him upon his return. I worry your resentment and anger will only end up hurting you. Take some time out for yourself consider your options. Lots to think about gabby. P.s I have a bitch mil . Wonder if there is any connection between bitch mil and damaged sons .. I'm thinking definetly .. take care gabby sending you love xxx

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  17. Phoenix, I totally understand the obsession. I don't get depressed per say, although I can feel a bit down and damn do i OBSESS. that for me, is the worst feeling in the world. It wastes all my time. My H REALLY seems to be on the right track. He even goes to therapy alone now which is a miracle. I never thought this day would come. But I obsess--is he finally going because he is contemplating or has had some sort of setback which he has not told me about? i cannot see how he possibly could. Timewise, back before d-day number 1 I thought there was absolutely NO chance he could do this. we both mostly work at home and when I am gone, well there's just not enough time to tend to an affair. Little did i know that he was into hookers--UGH. took no time at all...and they never call the house. So I wonder if he could possibly be doing this again when I am not around or not looking. My biggest problem now is obsessing. I can't stand the thought of him pulling one over on me again. Even though he shows NO signs, I wonder. and I wonder when I will stop this crap.

    And Gabby? That is just BS on your husbands part. Mine too had a thing at the start that he had no privacy, and that he had an e-mail set up for his sponsor and just for himself. It was later I found that THAT was the e-mail address he gave his most ardent whore, who has never written.
    The reality is, there are ALWAYS ways for them to hide it. I have full access to my H's phone and I am embarrassed when I feel the need to look at it. But every now and then I do. The reality again, is that he might have a throwaway phone, but if he does, I want this to be as HARD as possible for him. I don't want him to be able to pay through paypal or his bank account, I want him to physically need to crawl under the radar to pay for it. If he ever starts up again, it will be the hardest thing he's ever done. and I hope it hurts. but it would not hurt as bad as if I kicked his butt out of the house. This time i would not even send him a follow up text to tell him to eff off. lol Becky, any shrink I am sure, would back you up. So will we.

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  18. Thanks Sam A
    Yes I know I have to take control of this situation. For me that's easier said than done. I hate confrontations - (even when I am right), and at times when i have confronted h, he talks me down and gets angry etc (narcissistic traits), and his refusal to see my pain and be accountable when I've questioned him many times, have just made me give up until it boils over again. But, I have decided to go to a new IC, even if h doesn't want to go to MC. My new IC is great, and like others that I have seen, have told me, with H unwilling to do any work on the marriage, our marriage is doomed. I suppose it's really what I have known, just not wanting to admit, not wanting to throw away 30 years, but I can't do this on my own. I'll be going to my IC and working on me, and I suppose I now have to seriously start to make plans in the future for a life with just me and the kids - even if that's a year away by the time I start to sort things out. Hurting like hell, but I see no other option. I don't ever know if I'll get over the anger and resentment towards him and his pathetic cowardly ways and betrayals. Only time will tell. So I'll just put more effort into things and people that treat me with respect and give me enjoyment. H and his "mommy" aren't going until later in the year. I wonder if Elle or anyone else can share any insight and experiences into h and their toxic parents/ mothers - that still rely on their kids financially and MIL who ignore and disrespect us daughters in laws. How are you going Sam A? thinking of you often and wishing you all hugs and happiness
    Gabby xo

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    1. Hi Gabby

      I have felt so similar, my H also has a lot of narcissism qualities and it took me a long time to really see them for what they were and it hurt so so much. His complete unwillingness to hold my pain, be accountable, and be connected to what was actually happening was so heartbreaking to me. It took almost 1 yr of weekly therapy for me to really see more clearly, come to terms with his unwillingness to do the work, and fully truly know I deserve better and can build my own better life. And yes it did and does hurt like hell,but it is a pain that will eventually bring you where you need to be. I know it is aweful but stay in the pain even if your H won't.

      It also took me a while because I was doing a lot of work to honor my 15 year marriage and not "throw it away". Eventually I knew that I did and was honoring my marriage very meaningfully, but my H just wasn't and it takes 2 to have the type of relationship I want and deserve.

      Things are pretty hard right now with his accident and things for me got a bit side tracked, which I have been pretty mad about at times! I hate it when life is so unfair. But I have not lost sight of how I want to live my life. Even though, I'll spend some weeks giving my h suppprt. Also very sadly so far it does not seem like even this accident is going to push him into embracing the work.

      Hang in there Gabby focus on you, stay with the hard things and the joyful things. We love you and support you.
      Becky

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  19. Sounds like a plan Gabby, taking care of yourself can only ever be a good thing.. as for me I'm ok thanks, I've gone of the idea of having another child think it was a flying thought but reality is very different you guys were right when you said it's probably not the right time I can see that now and I totally agree.. I'm in the process of changing my job instead which is still very challenging as I've been in the same job for 8 years do interviews and filling out applications can be extremely nerve wrecking but it's the kind of adrenaline rush I need, I really think I lost a lot of my confidence the last few years that 'no fear' Sam seems to be fearful of everything and I hate that.. I was reading an article the other day about seeing the world through our children's eyes they have no fear, take risks and see life through innocent eyes I want some of that back in my life hence the job change think it will be a good start. Me and h getting on ok, he's still sleeping on the couch which is totally working fine with me. We've had some time on our own recently which I really enjoyed.. the affair seems a distant memory some days don't even think about it until he pisses me of. But I think we can both diffuse the situation better now, I don't go back to the affair like I used to it was draining and of no help whatsoever.. we're going away with the kids this coming weekend I'm just hoping for an easy relaxing family holiday but that never happens with a moody teenager and a h that doesn't know how to handle him can be a bit of a nightmare. I may have to book in some me time when we return lol.. I'm positive about life at the moment just because I'm putting me and my needs first for a change.. wish me luck I've got an interview tomorrow I'm seriously nervous .. I'll let you guys know how I get on .. sorry for the very long update : ) lots a love xxx

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    1. Sam A - thinking of you and sending you all the best of luck for this job change interview.
      Sending love to you across the miles

      (just getting a bit emotional at all the genuine caring love here from you all)
      Gabby xo

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    2. Sam A, Buy your husband the book about teenagers called "Mom and Dad, get out of my life but first can you drive me and Cheryl to the Mall" or something like that. Buy a guy with last name Wolfe. It's fantastic. It's hilarious. And it does an incredible job of reminding us parents not to take ANYTHING that teenagers say and do personally. You might want to read it to each other. It's hilarious. And it will really help.
      Congratulations on the job interview. Whatever happens, I hope you'll give yourself a ton of credit for just putting yourself out there. That's huge. I'm always so proud of my kids for taking chances, more than if it's easy for them and they succeed. I admire people who have the courage to just try, especially when they've taken such a beating from betrayal.
      Yay you, Sam A. Keep us posted.

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  20. Gabby, I hate that you are stuck in such a difficult situation. But I am so proud that you are taking every positive step you can to take care of yourself. We do support you. You deserve to be put first by your husband. He clearly does not understand, and does not want to understand, what you need to heal from the trauma that he has inflicted.
    I understand so well the darkness, the anger and despair. We make such firm resolutions and reason things out so well, but sometimes those negative emotions are just overwhelming. We have such ups and downs.
    Sam, I am so impressed with you! You are boldly taking action to make positive changes in your life. You are amazing!!

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  21. Thank you, friends. Your words mean so much to me. Hugs!!!

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  22. Cheers guys .. your words are so touching.. interview went great .. just waiting on a response I'll let you know .. eeeek hate waiting: )

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    1. No matter what, Sam A, I hope you can see this as a victory. It takes guts to put yourself out there, all the more when you've had such a blow to recover from.

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  23. I got the job : ) a great boost to my confidence.. xxx

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    1. Ignore my comment above. Or rather, add to it my congratulations. I'm so thrilled for you. Yay you!!!!

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    2. Sam A!!! Yes. Congratulations!!! So happy for you!!

      Love
      Becky

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    3. Sam A, way to go! Embracing change and moving forward! Congrats!

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    4. YEAH!!!!!!!!!!!
      I am so happy for you Sam A.
      Hugs
      Gabby xxxxxxxxxxxoooooooooooo

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