Monday, September 25, 2017

Becoming the Decider

There's a great conversation happening over on the Sex and Intimacy After Betrayal page. I'm struck by how vulnerable the women posting there are – how candid they are and how deeply they want to be seen and to be loved.
But I'm also noticing, there and on other threads, how many women wrap up their (completely legitimate) rants with something along the lines of "maybe I should be more patient" or "maybe I'm expecting too much".
So let me say this: You get to decide what you want your marriage to look like.
Especially after betrayal, we get to decide.
I've noticed how articulate and firm you all are when you're detailing what's missing in your relationships. You have absolutely no trouble outlining what you want and what you don't. But then...something happens. Doubt creeps in. Your inner critic whispers something to you that sounds like truth. Maybe that "you're demanding" or "you're never happy" or any number of messages that make you back down, that convince you that what you want isn't okay.
It is.
Whatever it is you want or need to feel like a full, respected, equal, valued part of your partnership is okay. In fact, it's a requirement.
Glennon Doyle, author of Love Warrior, put it this way in a recent podcast: "...the only advice that is worth hearing is what you already know. Nobody else knows what the heck you should do with your life." She recommends – as I do here and here and here – being still. Finding that time (indeed making that time!) to sit yourself. We are often good at avoiding that. Far better, we think, to do. To busy ourselves with the minutiae of the day – the laundry, the school forms, the grocery shopping, the Netflix binging. To just sit? Blech.
But it is in that stillness, that space where our thoughts are free to arise without getting crowded out or yelled at, that we discover we already have the advice we're seeking.
And it is there, too, when we wrestle with the discomfort of the emotions that arise – the ones that insist we have every right to want a respectful honest intimate partnership, the ones that refuse to be silenced – that we discover we can only treat ourselves respectfully by honouring what we want and need. Silencing ourselves isn't an option, nor should it be.
"...as women, we are trained to not go inside. We are consensus takers. We will ask every freaking body what we should do. We will trust the Internet before we trust our deepest selves," says Doyle.
This isn't to put Betrayed Wives Club down, nor is it to suggest it's not okay to ask for advice here.
Sometimes we need a light to guide us forward. But pay attention to your body's response to others' stories. Does something deep deep down say "yes, yes, yes. Exactly!" or is there a deep resistance. Not a "that sounds scary" but "that sounds wrong." Scary = good, much of the time. Wrong = wrong.
It's crucial to learn to follow the light inside each of us, the one that knows which direction is best for us. It's there, I promise. But if you've spent a lifetime ignoring it in favour of listening to your dark nasty critic outline the "shoulds", then you may need some practice finding it.
And when you do, let it light your way forward. Let it illuminate your wants and your needs to create the life, the marriage (or the divorce!) that feeds your soul. You get to be the decider of your own future.
Nobody else has that privilege. They have their own lives to decide.

20 comments:

  1. It took me a long time to wrap my head around what we went through because I couldn't find anything on the internet remotely similar. I would read the post on here and feel worse sometimes. My gut always told me what I had already known, what I had seen. My my mind and heart couldn't make sense of it until the last few conversations with the OW. I knew then that I was dead on with what I held onto for a year. All the energy that I spent on her and I already knew the truth. I over thought all the lies she told and this would drive me crazy. My husband has listened to me over and over even though it made him sick to think he had anything to do with her. I stopped listening to what other people were telling me, I listened to my gut. That inner voice that we have didn't fail me this time. The more I talked to her the more messed up I realized all involved were, including me. But what woman plans a wedding and tries to get pregnant from a man she barely had time to get to know very well. Someone she had known only weeks but was so desperate to have did things that were like living in a life time movie. I feel more at peace now, taking care of me, my husband and my youngest daughter and moving forward with hope for the future instead of dwelling on the past with the "should's". Resilience is something I feel I had from the beginning. Especially when you have deal with two people you love the most in your life suffer from mental illness due to this situation. I know that I will still have bad days and probably will for a long time, it's already been two years. At least with the answers I have now I can work on letting it go. When I walk now I listen to Brene Brown, Glennon Doyle and sometimes Oprah. I found the book Ann was talking about and will eventually buy it. I'm starting to like the new me better then the old me and I'm willing to let her go for my own piece of mind.
    Cathy

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    1. Cathy. If there's one thing I realize on a daily basis, is that no matter if we choose to stay or go, it takes resilience to move through betrayal, or as I like to call it, the shit storm, and I'm talking gragantuan strength, resilience, fortitude. The weight of it all and the strength we have to endure, process, try to make sense of it, realize that it's not about us, and we do. We are amazing and that is empowering. Sitting back and looking at the time that's gone by, 10 post DD2 for me, and all the knowledge gained about me, him, the pieces that come together, it's staggering at times, but we get through it. I am determined to become my own champion. I'm glad you like the new you cause I know she is amazing. We will transcend. Love and hugs to you...Michelle

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    2. Cathy, it sounds like you are in a better place. Mental illness of your family members I am sure makes things that much more difficult. I don't want to give advice, since I am only 9 mo past D day.. so I will just say this. God bless you, and prayers that your bad days will continue to become fewer and far between.
      <3

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  2. Elle. It's like we spent the weekend together, you and I, and spoke at length about me and how I doubted myself, who I am, who I've been, how I stifled myself because of what others, namely my husband, had to say. He criticized me for who and how I was/am. But that's all changed now. Letting go of the fear of "I may lose him" freed me to love who I am fully once again. I was wrong to ever doubt me, my decisions, and how I feel about things. How I want MY life to be. I felt that if he didn't like/love me, how could anyone else? What a crock of shit.

    Now that he is dealing with his darkness, he has told me how he kept me down so he would feel better about himself, and that he was trying to push me away so I would leave and he wouldn’t feel like he had failed yet again. He says he regrets all of that now and that he admires the woman I am, my strength and fearless vulnerability, my compassion, my philosophies, my code, and that he looks up to me once again as a guide as he gets to know who he really is and reinvent his life. High praise from someone I don’t trust much, and only time will tell if he has really seen the light and has stepped through the ring of fire, but until then I apologize to no one for my decisions on how to live my life. Be it laying in bed crying out pain, sitting still and working things out, or working on a crochet project while I watch Downton Abby. It’s MY life and I will never relinquish any facet of it again unless I want to change something about it. My beautiful, worthy, loving, juicy and radiant life that I am rebuilding. Love and light to you all

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    1. Ahh your story sounds similar to mine pre D day. My H also struggled with depression, refused to get help etc. I think he blames that on his emotional affair. I think its great that you feel you don't have to apologize for your decisions in your life and I hope I can get there one day. You are worth it, we all are. Sometimes it takes us awhile to realize that. God bless, <3

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    2. Olive, the idea of your husband putting you down to feel better about himself and not feeling like he had failed really resonates with how I think my husband has been. Now my husband is aware of it but hasn't articulated things yet as well as your husband has (about you and your qualities and how he will reinvent his life). My husband says he cares and wants to change but I think he fears he can't. Your philosophy is so inpiring about minding and valuing yourself. I have just started going through Downton Abbey on Netflix, it's my way to relax too! (I have not taken out my crochet blanket that i put aside a couple of years back though!) Thanks for your philosophy and I hope things continue to improve for you.

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  3. I am the forever martyr... always trying to make everyone else happy. Its's like, once I know everyone is happy I can finally relax and be happy. My happiness was determined by everyone else around me. I never realized this until now. This "event" has truly changed me. I am not sure if for the better. However it has made me realize, that for once, I can be ME. H doesn't get to decide how I grieve etc.. H has been great for the most part, putting me first (which he has NEVER done) in trying to make sure my needs are taken care of.. I am afraid this will change though. I feel like things are starting to slide just a bit... Will it go back to the way it once was? Because I am not sure I can continue to KNOW that how I feel is valid. I am full of self doubt now. I am afraid that he will start telling me that how I feel isn't right. He has already started to tell me that "every time we get into an argument I bring "it" up". Well I feel that every time I overreact about something (that usually ins't about the "event") that its because of harbored feelings.. Its only been 9 mo since D day (not a physical affair but an emotional once nonetheless, and HE pursued HER)... I struggle daily and I communicate that daily to him so it just seems like he would be more understanding. I want to love him again.. but right now I just don't. at least not like that.. I love him as the father of my children and the fact that he works hard to provide for us (by working extra, I work full time as well). He is my friend. I just feel empty right now.. I still get that gut punch everyday or every other day out of nowhere.. He just doesn't get it. Out of sight out of mind, I'm afraid he thinks.... I just really appreciate this blog so much. It has really made me feel like I am not alone. I really have no one to talk to. Or that I choose to talk to anyway. God bless you all. Thanks for listening to me ramble.

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    1. Twins twice
      I started a post and it disappeared so I'll try again, yes, I too struggle with him falling back into old habits but I struggle more with me falling back into old habits, like doubting myself doubting what I really feel because I've learned that this has changed me and not always in a good way. I'm trying to work on myself and allow him to work on himself but that is the hard part. I'm not struggling on him having pursued her so much anymore but how is he pursuing me and our relationship. I'm sure it's a daily struggle for him as well as me but if I dwell on that it leads me back to resentment because he started the shitshow with the first date. Period! It's been a very tough up and down emotional roller coaster but it feels better most of the time but when the bad days happen, it can take me back to the first day I found myself struggling with the texts from the cow while he was traveling back from a week long business trip. I was left devastated and we didn't even discuss it until the next day after I spent the whole night crying and puking my guts out. So I flashed back to that for many months but now I can say that this is how it happened but it's not happening now and usually I'm able to move through those feelings. It's tough! Sending you hugs and yes it helps to know you are not the only one that feels like this!

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    2. TT...One of my biggest struggles was, and some times still is, trying to please everyone first, then me. But everyday I tell myself "me first." This event has changed all of us in so many ways. I've known from DD2 that I will not let his actions define me but it took months to really feel that and get to a point where I no longer question myself cause of someone else. About 3 months ago, I had a moment of clarity where I just said "fuck this shit." In that moment I let go of ever having a relationship with my husband and with it went so many fears. Fear of him not understanding what I'm going through, cause he never will, Fear of having a life without him, fear of how will I ever make it and so on. With this came empowerment through realization that I am my own person and I will do what ever I have to do without worrying if it will affect him badly. I live in integrity so I never rub his nose in what he did cause that only leaves me stuck in the past pain of his actions. I expect nothing from him outside of respect and honesty. He commented once that I have a lot of resentment and I replied with hell yes I do. I realize that those resentments will go away if he continues on his path of healing. Bullshit tactics will keep both of us mired in the shit storm. I do not want to stay there. I find that I don't feel love for him either and I think that's a natural response to his choices...I feel that emptiness as well. I don't respect my husband right now and he knows that, but I do admire him for finally dealing with his issues and he knows that as well. I feel that his path is going to be much more uncomfortable than mine. Not only is he dealing with the guilt, remorse an regret of what he did, he is also dealing with his life long issues. I feel real sorry for the guy but I will support him in his journey as long as he is honest with himself and me. TT, I would ask you to spend some time examining your fears. I did worse case scenarios of my horrendous fears and found that I am in control of my situation. That brought a lot of relief in an already stressful time. Again, I realized my own personal power. How you feel during this surreal time is valid. Everything you believed in has been crushed and you have to rebuild again. Never forget that you are your own construction crew. You have the blue prints that no one can change. You are so not alone. Many hugs to you...♥

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    3. Twins twice, teresa, yes I am with you on this, its still so hard (its 3.5 years from d-day 1 and 3 years from d-day 2) and still the trigger times are not dealt with well by my husband, in fact he turns on me and makes it all so much worse. (I've posted on this below.) I am doing a lot of work to help myself but the long term bad interactions between us and the terrible way triggers are dealt with leave me wondering if we are ever going to get out of this. I want to be happy and strong.

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  4. I love this post so much. Yet I do struggle with how much compromising I should do, for the sake of our being a couple.
    I have no problem doing things for me now. I go out alone or with friends. I put my needs first. A lot. But, sometimes I question if it's too much? And then he may point out that I seem self involved to the point of not bending. But I think I'm still entitled to it.
    Example: he wanted me to sit outside with him last night. I did. It was a beautiful evening and he was fully feeling it. But as I sat there, I kept thinking of the laundry that needed folding. So, I left after awhile. Later, in bed, he said that it seems I'm unwilling to do anything else except for what feels right to me.

    Damn straight.


    So, how much of that is being too selfish? Do I have to meet him halfway for this marriage to work? This type of talk was constant in our couples therapy after the affair (we no longer go. I didn't want to hear another word about what I needed to be doing)
    I think I've closed myself off a bit from him. We are two years and four months outside of DDay. It's better, but triggers abound, as we live in the same town as the whorebag. So, can I still decide that I don't wanna weed the garden. I don't wanna sit quietly right now. I don't wanna make dinner.

    Nope. You can't make me! Lol!!

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    1. Tryme, YES.. YES YES YES. Exactly how I feel. I constantly self doubt. Am I being unreasonable? Since he is "trying" and I am "not" even though I feel like me staying is "trying"enough? Glad I am not the only one! I feel exactly the same way as you.

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  5. I really struggle with this right now. A lot of what Tryme says. I feel like as a person I am pulled in so many directions. I have made choices and limit what I say yes to but still with the basics of kids, work and self care it is too much. I have that happen where my husband wants me to do what he wants when he wants. It is all in a nice way. Asking me to pick a movie so that we can sit and watch it together. But that is what he wants. Sometimes I want to be in a room with no noise or tv and just read. He would never do that. He would lay down with me and read his phone or fall asleep maybe. So as has been stated when to compromise. Sometimes I feel like if I do everything how I want then there is no way we will stay married. We have many common interests but with life the way it is right now without one of us giving up something then we are separate and many times so we can conquer and divide what needs to get done.

    I guess overall I am having trouble of envisioning what the marriage I want. I think in a way I am holding on to my ideal and that will never be. I honestly feel like many days I might as well be alone forever. I just do not know if I will ever have the ability to trust anyone. I just have a feeling of being let down by everyone. Sometimes it is minor ways. In the end if the only person I can trust and control is myself then I am not sure it is worth all this pain. Maybe it is just me feeling tired of this healing process and life in general. My husband does not understand and I think finds it upsetting and disappointing that I extrapolate how he treated me with the world at large but it is how it feels to me. Maybe it is bad luck but even with friends I make plans and lately everyone cancels. I guess I am in a questioning mood and just not sure where to go with it.

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  6. In the past I would do anything to try and make his life easier which definitely became a detriment to me (he cheated with many women during our entire relationship and in his marriage before me). I would hesitate and most times not bring something up that bothered me because I was scared - scared of causing drama, scared of the eggshells, scared of him ending our relationship AGAIN. I thought he left due to a breakdown from depression, but it turns out he thought he loved at least 2 of the women.


    I am learning to put my needs and feelings first. He was on disability for 4 months after the suicide attempt (DDay #2 was via suicide letter, he confessed everything), and his boss recently contacted me as he cleaned out my spouses office. I let my spouse know I would be getting this box with items from his office and I saw on his phone record that he texted and called his boss the next day. I checked his phone and he deleted all records of these texts and phone calls out of his phone. It made me feel sick and in the past I would have excused this as him being a private person....well not anymore. This was him trying to control what his boss was going to give me and I knew it when I saw the phone records which is why I checked his phone. I confronted him and told him that his behaviour was deceptive and put me back a few steps. If he was concerned about what was in the box his boss was going to give me, he should have said that and ask that we look through the box together. He said his only concern was something would trigger me, to which I replied that he didn't want to deal with me and that trigger. Let's keep it real.


    It is so hard to be vulnerable with so many lies, deception and betrayal in our past but I have to be vulnerable and open to us and this healing. What I need most from him (at this time) is 100% TRANSPARENCY. Transparency in his thoughts, fears, feelings, love. I can check the phone records (I will eventually stop) but can't check these things.


    I can honestly say at 9 months from DDay #1 and 6 months from DDay #2, this experience has made me focus more on myself, my children, friends and family. I am so much more of a compassionate person to them and myself. I have a hard time looking at my spouse and he even feels different to me and I hope that changes, but my focus is not all about him anymore.


    I appreciate that this experience may be the cause of the extra compassion.

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  7. I'm doing a Steven Stosny rewiring exercise these weeks (12 repetitions a day) which transforms anxious feelings and memories into an associated image base of myself as a strong, capable, compassionate person. It’s tremendously helpful and i can hear the new strength coming out in how I speak about myself to the family. I've been a SAHM (but writing novels alongside - as yet unpublished). I'm applying for a job right now, I think I need to feel real and alive and shake things up and be seen in a new light. There have been some very concerning moments between my husband and I. Recently I had a massive meltdown when it appeared he had lied about something. (Alerting his aunt to our non attendance at a party). He claims he wrote the text but did not press send. When I checked I did not see an unseen text but it was a hurried check. I really could not say then whether I was right or if he was lying and I just broke down because of that awful position we are left in once our closest person has deceived, gone behind our backs and lied to our faces. He has never come clean of his own accord, I discovered a dabble in porn this April but he admits that he probably would not have told me. A second issue is his complete lack of being able to show compassion if the problem is related to, or is a trigger regarding the affair.

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  8. Part 2
    Two days ago we accidently ran in to a woman who was not the OW but another person that he was having borderline inappropriate text exchanges with ('babe' and too many). He has a terrible memory and could not remember the woman’s name at first, then was flustered and didn’t introduce me in person (indicated his ‘family). I was strong and okay at the time but the ensuing conversation later ended up with me being on a desperate low. He becomes so defensive that he turned the conversation against me, felt aggrieved at what I was saying and said things against me at a time when he should have been supportive and loving. Seeing the woman brought back how dismissed and insulted and backstabbed I was by him, not loved, honoured, cherished. I have asked him to do some work on himself and on a relationship issue between us (defensiveness and resentment on both parts.) He had been ‘too busy’ but now has agreed as I said I cannot accept him bringing me down any more when I am working so hard to get myself strong again. I will have to walk out if it does not change. My only concern now is what time span, number of chances to give before finally deciding to save myself. (We have 4 kids, so it’s harder.)

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    1. I feel a lot of similarities to what you are saying. The littlest things set me off and it is in a feeling where almost everything is brought back from the feelings of betrayal, lack of trust and lying. It might even be something that would been seen as positive or small. Nothing big but it all resurfaces.I have been thinking a lot about this. I think there are a variety of reasons for me. Basically I always have to be the one to confront him or bring anything up. This can be something like the affairs, porn, drinking etc. Or it can be something simple like our schedule feels too busy or dividing out household responsibilities. I feel like if I don't bring it up then it does not get mentioned. For us dday happened. Then dday 2 was 5 months later. In between there without trying to find these things I find a fake email, porn use being more than once in a while. I had to be the one to bring it up. If we are not intimate as often I have to bring it up. Granted when I bring these things up especially now it is usually a response of he was thinking the same thing. It leads me to question why is it me always bringing this stuff up. He sees it too. I get it we are tired and busy but I would love for him to say something.

      I do know I feel resentment due to how disclosure occurred and the trickle of it all. I still wonder if I know the real truth or everything. And I am not talking details since I know that will do me no good. I also feel like his explanation of why is not adequate. He puts 100% credit in his current actions. He is right he cannot change his past. I however feel work needs to be done related to the past and understanding so history does not repeat itself.

      Just recently for a variety of reasons our lives are super busy. I feel like it is when we first had kids in that 0-5 years old phase but now with teens and busy works schedules. I just feel like we are slipping away from each other in that same way. Maybe that is what he felt like at that time. He swears to me he does not feel that way, I am his best friend, I mean more than anything blah blah blah. All nice to hear but it is like a deja vu feeling for me. And because of what he did I question everything trying to see what my gut tells me.

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    2. Hi Hopeful 30, you say you are the one to bring it up each time. YES! EXACTLY! When he acted terribly last weekend he was still on a time lag of feeling affronted and I had to bring up and explain why how he had acted was so unhelpful. I say I don't want to be pscyhoanalysing him or suggesting but I have had to try to see from his perspective to stay. He has done some work on himself but it's only scratching the surface. What you say about all the triggers and everything brought back and the cynical view of life, yes again, which is why I've been doing the Stosny stuff (eg Living and Loving after betrayal book is great or i'm also doing his downloadable anxiety course (similar material). It really helps with not going down the rabbit hole and tying all the ills of the world to our own personal tragedy. This with another online anxiety course helped me, get active, walk on beach, which led to me accidentally meeting acquaintances, chatting, connecting, giving them words of encouragement, smiling more, feeling stronger, seeing my value in the family. It helps in general but the trigger stuff, the connection to the total disregard and nastiness of the past takes a lot to get over (there are some exercises for that.)

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    3. Part 2 ( I pressed send as sometimes I lose a whole post). Hopeful I identify too with the busyness, I now have 3 teenagers and a nearly ten year old. It's important to keep an eye on everyone and I do that. I wonder if I get a job if h will take up the support of the kids. I want to get a job to cover myself in case this all falls apart though I may not be able to follow my creative writing dream. He has taken up acting and of course work is really busy so our relationship salvage fits in around it (he did take some days off) but issues drag on and three years later huge issues remain. I really feel as i think you do that it would make a huge differnce if they put in a concerted effort and focus on repairing. I say to my husband that there is still a giant hole in the garden, that he can plant as many flowers (nice times) as he likes but he needs to fill in that hole to stop me falling back into it. He needs to make up for the disloyality and lies. xx

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    4. FOH, I totally agree. My husband is doing a great job with the moving forward but when he says the past is too painful for him. Well not my problem he was the one that made the poor decisions and it feels as if he dumped it on my lap and has said here you go. I was really backing off of work and had planned on doing no work and just focus on family but then dday happened. Well I restarted and am super busy now. It is great that I was able to jump back in and be in demand but it also is upsetting to me on some levels. I can say getting back to work has added a lot more stress to my life. I thought I was done with that aspect and had given a lot in other areas of my life so that I would not have to be in this stage right now. I also can say it is rewarding and feels good to both contribute financially to our family but also know that I could support myself. I can never compete with my husband's earnings not after giving up my career and further education. I paid for his education and fully supported us through his training, starting a business and many other financial expenses. He says no matter what happens I will benefit since I get half. Yeah me. But as I have told him he is left with his high earning career and also his sterling professional reputation. We got into it a few months ago. I got upset since another mom said she had no idea I worked. And I was saying to my husband that it was upsetting that someone I have known over 15 years has never asked me one question however I know every detail of her life and career before kids. He said he liked people not thinking I worked since it made him feel/look more successful. Since basically he can take credit for all we have and do. It is honestly how he feels he did not say anything incorrectly. I am still upset and bothered by this and think is this who he is???

      Sorry to go on and on but I can so relate. And I keep telling him as you have you can do everything right but if the past is not dealt with then there is a huge hole. Ugh.

      I am looking into the specifics of the Stosny you listed. Thanks!

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