Here's a good song - "Enough" by The Mrs. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I4_USW-FgKo I like to blare this one in my car or just here at home anytime I need a good pick-me-up!
I believe this more than ever. What I find a challenge is even during the "affair years" my husband would say I was too good for him and I deserved better. I always thought oh that is so nice and he was being sweet, supportive and positive. Now I know he did mean it in a major way. And he still says the same thing. I know there is new meaning behind it but it does make me get a knot in my stomach hearing it now.
I never thought I was as strong as I am. It is one major positive to come out of all of this.
Takes a while to get here!!! Without having married the fool I did and going through this awful shit pool i was thrown in I would never have seen with such clarity the enoughness I have. The selfishness of others is NOT my baggage. You treat me poorly it is your fault... not because I deserve it. I was so blind to this while he abused me emotionally during the affair. And then after discovery to see how all my efforts were wasted on such a fool of a man-boy. I build a life with someone that had the emotional maturity of a 3 year old. What does an equal partnership look like?? What does it feel like?? How do you get there?? Do we have a life together after the craziness of babies is over and they all 3 are grown up and then move out? We will be left alone. Together. That is scary. How will it all go for us...My solution right now is to take it day by day. Putting my trust in God and time. After affair We still have to climb over the mountains life gives us together... only now we have an extra load to carry getting over the insanely stupid betrayal. Thanks for the extra weight man-boy. (Bitterness vented)
I am enjoying my new found enoughness and less triggered days. Knowing that I'm not alone fighting my own mind for peace. I see my own thoughts written out again and again in these posts. LLP did an amazing job suming up all the depressing thoughts we fight. But we are SO enough. Sucks to be him and the whore who clearly doesn't get it. Imagine the self hate and insecurities inside them. Gross. It does put a wicked smile on my face however because I struggled for so long thinking i was lesser then her. I would never ever EVER trade places with her. Even if he had left me. And I take a lot of happiness from that. I like me. :)
Blindsided, I have asked myself many of those questions especially about why are we together and does it make sense for the future beyond kids. My husband is 100% in and more dedicated than ever. Now I feel like is this right for me?? Is this what I want "forever". I do this with all aspects of my life. I am less of a day to day person and more big picture. My husband is very day to day and it helped him get through his affair years I think. He only focused on what was in front of him not anything else. I need to find a healthy balance between the two perspectives. Also I have told him often that I am glad this came out now. I am not sure we would have lasted and even if he was not having any affairs the shame and distance he created would have made our life as empty nesters horrible. Also as we approach the teen years it is good we are closer than ever. It is way more demanding than when they were little. Our kids are great but way more academically is at stake, activities are draining, driving them everywhere, social needs, emotional needs it is so much more intense than stressing about a cold or if they missed a nap or had a bad night of sleep. It is all good but I try to remind myself of these things daily.
I agree with everything in your last paragraph! For the 10 years he was having his sporadic affairs I was always wondering what is wrong with him. It was subtle since his encounters were so sporadic. There was one aha moment for me 3 years before dday. My husband went on an extended trip with friends. It was the first time he had been gone longer than three nights. I remember him calling and I honestly did not care to talk with him. I was so enjoying time by myself and with the kids. He was so bothered when we said hi but got to run. It hit me during those 8-10 days that it was not me. It was 100% him that was making our lives miserable and unhappy and it had nothing to do with me. We were all so happy with him gone. I never took the leap to leave him and maybe I should have. From that point forward I really did what I wanted. I do not think that sat well with him. He ended the affairs on his own 15 months before dday. He was strongly considering leaving me and just saying it was not working out but not owning up to anything he did so he could as he has told me "save face" and still look like the "good guy". I feel most sad for him and the ow. He is really carrying around a huge burden and flaw that I am not sure he will ever fully recover from. I agree I would never trade places with him or the ow. I have always been able to put my head on my pillow and know that I have done my best and been honest. I have always been true to myself. He was lost and immature. So sad.
Hopeful: oh boy yes!! Dido!! With three babies waking up every hour nursing or a pee bed or a lost blanket or a bad dream I got no sleep and was drained. But it got to the point when I didn't even care if he was gone because of his attitude. He was no help to me anyways!! They push him away now when he tries to be with them. They tell him they don't Like him that they want him to go back to work or they wish he was me. It kills him. He gets angry at the constant rejection sometimes... but after months of neglecting them and being away and months of seeing me in the state I was in after d day how could they not figure something out and point some of their own frustrations at someone? They are human as well, and have part of me and him... the anger the charm the carung the selfishness... they have the good and the bad as we do. It's been over a year of their life. Im urging him to have patience with them as I have had with him. "I regret the patience I had with my kids when they were young" said no parent ever.
PS I would take baby age over teen years ANY day. I keep telling them to stop growing but two have birthdays this month and they refuse not to celebrate them for the sake of my happiness in not seeing them get older. How selfish of them (sarcasm) lol. Teen years terrify me. I have huge anxiety over it. I'm in the high schools for work and it's crazy different from my days roaming the halls. I can't imagine what it will be like for them. I'm a huge mama bear. I'm not looking forward to taking a seat on the bench as they start to figure out who they are. But im doing my very best to give them a solid foundation to fall on dispite the sludge hammer my husband took to it.
I still LOVE you hun despite what happened even if I tell you otherwise. If you are reading my posts still I know ypu have been and i want you to keep reading. Im not writing for you I never was. Im writing for ME. As difficult as it is to read this is my truth. This is what is inside me. Ignore My bad writing and all :) You dont have to agree 100 percent... but can't you at least accept that this is how I feel and that perhaps your actions can pursuayed me to think more where you are at? Certainly anger towards me will never solve our issues and I agree that my anger will not either. I need you to help me when I fall into the anger trap and I will try to do the same. There are lots of strong amazing women who have stuck it out with their spouses on here. Their advice is well founded. We will get through this so much stronger if you can open up to change fully. And it starts with TRUTH. We need truth to be our foundation for trust and love to grow. I love our family. We have the best family in the world. It's all I ever wanted in this world. I'll keep climbing this mountain for our family if you are beside me.
Blindsided, Yes, yes, yes! One thing that is so critical and my husband and I now reflect on it now is that thankfully it all happened and came out when it did. We are a unified front and dealing with teen issues even the good ones is hard. Like you said starting to let them go and figure out things on their own. Yikes!! And for us to be on the same page is the best. Also last night my husband got into a disagreement/fight with my youngest (his twin more than ever..) well I had some insights after the fact. And I shared them with him in a nice way but he took them and there was zero part of him that was defensive. That would have never happened pre dday or even post dday early on. We all have issues and I am not perfect but by nature I am more insightful and with those insights I work to change and reflect and also being a mom I think that comes with it too. It was really a testament of how far he especially had come. In the past that would have never gotten addressed or been a big fight.
I also think it is important for husbands to realize they can be part of the healing process. This is hard for them. My husband struggles so much but there is satisfaction and healing that comes with that. It takes a ton of work and time but it is worth it.
My kids don't know anything really. They did notice my husband being around more and involved more and us spending more time together. But they see it as a good thing. And we have always tried to be honest that in any relationship/marriage there are disagreements and rough times that need to be worked through. Saying all of that many movies we have seen lately have betrayal themes. One we were watching with our kids and they hammered the man in the story who was cheating on his wife. This really has hit him hard. He broke down over the holidays after that. I think he has a lot to work through still. I keep supporting his goal of living a transparent life and one he is proud of as a husband and father.
Good reminder, I know I'm enough for me. I even like myself. I feel confident about me. Then why don't feel like I'm enough for him? What is the difference? I think of all the lies he told well after DD about the affair. Here are random thoughts on being enough for him which drive me crazy nutty. Of course sex was better with her, he lied about so much why would he say it was better? He would have to be a bigger dumb shit to say it was better. So next time he says, this is the best sex I ever had. I'm going to say - I don't believe you. You have been with so many women how can I be the best? I married you when I was 25. He says it is the emotional connection. Whatever. I know I sound cynical but isn't that part of questioning? Not really falling hook, line and sinker but asking for clarification? Does it make a difference? What difference does it make? Somehow and I don't know why yet, it does make a difference to me. There isn't anything I can do about it. I guess I can handle MORE honesty now. Back in year one or two - just tell me anything that makes me feel better. Now that I'm enough, I'm ready to handle more truth. I seek more truth from him. Not what HE thinks is best for me. I'm enough so I'm ready to decide what is best for me. I want to rock the damn boat. I want to rock it hard and know it is real. So this year he is going to be in a rocky boat. I'm ready for the real truth from him. I'm not going to allow him to decided what is best for me. He did a shitty job of it in the past. He isn't the best decision maker for me. So to circle back to my original thought, I need to take out my big red bullshit meter again, rock the boat of truth. On the other hand rocking the boat means I'm truthful with him as well. Some women say I know enough. Well I still don't know the truth and it bugs the shit out of me therefore I don't know if I'm enough for him? I want the person I'm spending my life seconds, minutes, hours, days and years on are based on something that is real. I don't know what it is like to be married to someone who thinks enough of marriage not to cheat. I will never know what that feels like. So at least I deserve to know what it is like to married to someone who will tell me the truth. What pleasure do I derive out of testing him? It is called learning to trust again. Even a judge won't listen to someone who has perjured themselves, they go to jail. Can an embezzler ever get a job again? Can an adultery ever be a good H again?
To SS1 - my heart goes out to you. I wish I had a wand and was your fairy god mother. You make think I'm over the edge but I do believe in guardian angels. I have seen my kids get out of falling, run over, mortal type situations not to believe in angles that intervene from time to time. I pray for your strength, acceptance and daughter. You are enough in many ways - can I adopt you?
LLP I love your fire! Rocking the boat feels good sometimes, especially when its involves putting ourselves first. :) I will take all offers of fairy god mothers, angels and adoption! Are you even old enough to be my mother? I doubt it. We can adopt each other as sisters! I loved reading what you wrote. Felt like the hug I was really needing.
I'm going to give him this list of rock the boat questions to answer when he feels he has answers. Although it doesn't look it, I think I need this so I won't wake up with nightmares of him and her laughing at me.
Why did you respect the idea of marriage, vows in the first place? Why didn’t you want to protect your marriage? Did you ever think of me or our family while you were with her? Why didn’t you trust me enough to share your hatred/dissatisfaction/resentment for me before you allowed yourself to be left vulnerable in so many ways? (work, family, home, STD, reputation) What lies did K tell you? What lies did you tell K? How did feel trying to put our marriage back together and lying at the same time? What did you think would happen if I caught you lying while trying to recover our marriage? Why did you think you knew what was best for me by withholding the entire truth? Why did you feel like you had to take care of her, entertain her, feel sorry for her? (allowing her into our home, showing her our farm, let her sit on your lap and cry, consoling her, giving her money, giving her gifts?) Why did you never see me wanting the same thing? What allowed you to be that way with her and not me ever in our married life? Why would you have more loyalty to K than me? How could you not think of the consequences? What were you like when you were with her compared to how you are now? Why the sudden passion for me once you got caught? How could you do this if you loved me? Did you compare us? Did you ever do anything sexual with her that you have not done with me? I mean anything that has to do with touching each other. Were you sexually adventurous with K? Did you lie when you said the sex could have been telephone sex? I can see why you wouldn’t want to tell me at the beginning it was a great relationship with great sex. Why did you put so much value on the sexual attention? Why keep going back? Did you think about K when you were intimate with me? I know the affair was sexual but do you consider your long-term affair an emotion one too?
LLP YOU ARE ME. I lived that thought line. It wrecked me. It changed everything I ever believed in. LLP I want so desperately for you to have peace. I hate you are feeling this pain. I hate we are all here... But please please please don't do what i have done emotionally to myself... or maybe it is necessary to get over I don't know.
I hated big. I hated him. I hated everything. I hated our car because it took him to her. I hated his job it lead him out of town. I hated the food I cooked our family because I wondered if she cooked that for him. I couldn't stand my head. I was tortured. The hate was so intense. I am also a detail person.. I had to know it all. And I'm glad I know most... I bet like 80%. Im no longer obessive and I think time and anti depressants helped rid me of the obessesive thoughts that just would not go away. i do still get bothered but its not as big. It was as if a huge pressure was in me to ask these questions that came in my head. Even if i tried to avoid it would come back stronger. I found out many details this way. My husband was and is a very sick man with what he was able to pull off. If everyone knew what he did... the details... there would not be a person in his life that would look at him the same. My affair was also very emotional and he treated her better then he ever treated me pre affair. But Elle and these women helped me so much to see that My husband did not do this to me personally but to himself. He was after the image he saw of himself when he looked at her. She was "hotter" then is fat wife and she wanted him. That fed his self hating image and he wanted more because at the time, it looked like this was what he was missing... that somehow he would have more value if someone else wanted him. Selfishness to its core. I feel sorry for him. Seriously. I know I chose To be with him. It's not like I'm hideous or didn't have options. I put up with his shitty behaviour because i loved him, our family, and the life we built. I hoped he could see what was lacking in himself and i was prepared to give him time to get there. This fat ugly wife was not prepared to have him choose a whore of a woman for 5 months to get there... but that is what happened. Life happened. He fucked up becuase he doesnt have the foundation that i do. He is blind. I'm now helping him see. And PS...the affair diet has taken me down to my university weight of 115!! I just had a baby that prick. Marriage is a choice. Not a destiny soul mate bullshit. You choose each other dispite other options... because to have a partner in life comes with so many more benefits then jumping from one bed to another. To know you have done this to your family... the one thing that does give him TRUE joy in his life is killer on him. He knows this now finally. I pray yours does too... that he regrets this to his core and is fueled with a desire to overcome his own issues to figure out how he went so terribly wrong. Blindsided.
I wanted to say what I learned about the "better" sex issue. I was stuck on the better factor. I've only had him... that's it. I'm not experienced or know anything. Im kind a prude i guess? She is a whore. So clearly the sex was different. Better? It's all in the context. Think about this. When you are with a man sexually, it is pleasing sure. But do you find happiness in It? Is there joy after the sex is over? No. It is a lust driven action. A momentary good feeling. You find joy and happiness in safety, compassion, forgiveness, commitment and all of that is love. The sex is like dessert. One day you could really like chocolate cake... then you get sick of it and cheese cake is your preference but it's all the same, a moment pleasure then once eaten gone. No joy, no life happiness. It's meaningless. If he has guilt it will taint any memory he has with her. She is a loser. She knows It, he knows it and you know it. She is NO BETTER. As one person pointed out to me on here and it was one of my ah-ha moments... the OW "is as ugly as sin". I would like to add to you that: so was their sex.
Hugs LLP. Your posts kicks ass...you know how to put all my rambling thoughts down better then if I had 100 000 characters to write within. Elle you really gotta figure out a way to extend our limits on posting lol nvm I just talk to much. :) Blindsided.
I finally made it past the 1st year of Dday #1, in December. It was an emotional roller coaster of a year. If it wasn't for my sisters and this site, idk where I would be right now. I'm 31 yrs old, married for 12 yrs. I believe his random online hook ups began a few years back,but could be more. Of course he won't say BC he thinks I'll get hurt more than I already have-which is not possible. There are some things that I can't get over (besides the obvious)such as him having sex in the family van where our kids sit! I've been trying VERY hard to keep my emotions in check and portray a happy family for our kids sake. I wish I can talk to my mom about it but it would break her and I don't want to do that to her. Every time I look at his face it's all I think about, but when he asks what's wrong, why I'm looking at him, I say I'm just admiring his handsome features!lol (Eyeroll). I'm carrying a ton in my heart but noone knows. The 4 people I've told keep telling me how strong I am, but they don't know how broken I am on the inside.
Dear Angie...having a D day anniversary at this time of year must be difficult.Please remember that you have the right to ask any and all questions you have.Only you can decide if the answers are painful or not. I told my H that if he wanted to stay with me be has to be 100% forth coming.If he asks you why you are staring into his eyes tell him to are trying to find the man who you fell in love with.1 am 2+ years out and I still do this.Hugs to you my friend
I am coming up to two years since I found out about my h sexual affair with a woman over two years. Once I found out about the affair I found out he was sexting two other women. We have been married for 37 years. I let him stay for a "second chance" although he has already used up his chances. I question myself everyday. I stay for my family. I am in a very lonely relationship and each and every month I give myself another deadline to leave. The deadline comes and goes and here I am...still here. What makes me stay? I don't trust him anymore and not sure if time will help with that. This has taken a toll on me big time and I don't know if tbis is where I want to be. Because of these feelings I struggle daily so scared I will be blindsided once again. Any help and advise?
Anonymous, I would strongly urge you to find a counsellor who can help you understand your own reluctance to leave. We often stay out of fear. The unknown can feel terrifying, especially when we're feeling beaten down and exhausted. But you deserve better than this. You deserve to feel emotionally safe, to feel good about who you are and your role in the world. And you can't get that when you're in a relationship in which you feel invisible and emotionally unsafe. Start with a counsellor. Share here too. So many of us have been where you are and can help you draw the roadmap you need to a better life. But start by knowing it's possible. That you can create something better for yourself.
Thank you Elle. I guess I stay out of fear as I get older. I also fear that my kids will abandon me if they ever knew for whatever reason. He has caused me so much emotional pain and yet can carry on day to day. His mother said to me the other day...I am so lucky to have him as my husband..he is a mommys boy and those are the best to keep. I almost started to cry and wanted to tell her that he is not the mommys boy she thinks he is. She was quite smitten about it. But I just nodded. A counsellor for me is too expensive..right now anyways.
I'm so sorry for the pain you're in. Consider finding a counsellor who has a sliding pay scale. Or try the Infidelity Counselling Network -- the link is on the right side column of this site. It's a pay-what-you-can system and the women are trained peer mentors. I just think you need someone to help you through this. It's no way to go through life.
I agree it is no way to go through life. Some say an affair will either break a marriage or make a marriage stronger. I do not feel my marriage has gotten stronger. Answer this..how do you carry on without the daily struggle of knowing your husband slept with another woman? How do any betrayed wives accept this and why do we think its okay to stay and work it out. Why does a husband need to be cottled and praised about absolutely eveything. I don't get and never have gotten any of that during my entire 37years of marriage. Maybe this is a sign for me to move on and out and see what my life is like with just me. I am tired of hearing how it will make me stronger. I don't feel strong about staying and letting him think I will never leave him. I don't believe I will ever be over this and I know I don't know the whole story of all the women he has been with and that is something I just can't live with.
It isn't the affair that either makes a marriage stronger or fall apart, it's the RESPONSE to the affair. It takes a whole lot of work to rebuild a marriage after infidelity. And if your husband isn't interested in doing the work, then nothing will improve. Staying in a marriage after infidelity is not at all about being "okay" with it. It's about being willing to give someone – WHO IS SHOWING YOU THAT HE DESERVES IT – a second chance. Nobody should require being coddled and praised about everything -- that's not a marriage, it's tyranny. Ultimately, Anonymous, it's up to you how you proceed. But, again, I urge to try and find a counsellor who you can afford or give the Infidelity Counselling Network a try. You deserve to heal from this pain, no matter whether you stay or leave.
That is why I dont have a counsellor..the one person I did talk with told me it either makes or breaks. My husband appears to be willing to do anything so I dont toss him to the curb but he has lied so much and been able to hide it..how do I really know he is being truthful? Perhaps I am the one that doesnt want to make the effort anymore..
I think that sometimes is the case. We're so beaten down by the lies and the betrayal that it feels impossible to trust again. But that is why I think counselling is so crucial for you. Whether or not you stay or go, YOU need to heal from this. You need to find a way to move forward, with or without him, in a way that allows you to find joy in life again. Until you decide whether or not you want to make the effort, you can focus on YOU, not the marriage, not him. I really hope you'll do this for yourself.
I need to get past the fact thst if I do leave it will hurt alot of my family. I know I shouldn't worry about what people think but I worry about how my children who are now 30 years old and have families of their own will take it. My h told me if I decide to leave..everyone will adjust and move on with their lives. I will move on and so will he. It just breaks my heart to have all of this thrown in my face. And left to try and pick up the pieces and try to fit them back together.
I think we too often overestimate our own control and underestimate others' resilience. I suspect your children want you to do what's right for you, even if it means experiencing some pain for them. They're adults. By living a life according to your own value system, you're modelling to them what that looks like. If, God forbid, they ever find themselves in the same situation, would't you want them to do what felt right to them, rather than trying to spare others? It isn't selfish to live by your values. It's self-respect.
I should ask how do I get past all of this and move on? With or without him? The first six months after I found put he was very loving and attentive and warm. Now not so much...I feel he may have given up on me not really understandings how traumatic tbis has been for me. So for a year and a half I have not felt his warmth therefore I have not returned it. He is the one that needs to change not me. Am I right or delerious?
Anonymous, Yes, he needs to change. But you have absolutely no control over whether he does. What you can control is you. And so that's where you need to focus. What do YOU want that is within your control? Are you in therapy? If not, I would encourage you to find someone who can help you find your way through this and process the pain. Betrayal is trauma. And by healing yourself, you're better able to set boundaries. He can either learn to respect them (for instance, a boundary might be, I cannot stay in this relationship if you won't seek therapy individually or as a couple) or he's telling you he's not willing to change. Either way, it makes your path far more clear rather than passively waiting for him to take responsibility for himself and his choices.
My finances are going to play a big factor if I leave. Its easy to stay because of that. I m approaching 60 years old..not alot of employment out there. We are self employed and he seems reluctant to take on new work. I wonder if that is a plan of his. If he is not working..no money for me. These are all the things I think of. I think he is always making a plan.
I am the same anonomys as above. Just passed the 2 year since d day. I still ponder every day to stay or go..why can't I stop this madness? I will ask my husband if he truly wants to be in this relationship..does he truly love me. He says yes then asks "what up"? Its like whenever I ask him that he thinks something is going on. He will not talk about any feelings. We are both on edge all the time...like we are "just here". "Just together". Almost every morning he wakes me up for sex....I don't sometimes want to have sex right then and there. He just seems to always want it. I tell him there is more to marriage than just sex. I know it is important in a relationship but that also puts me back into his affair. I feel like he thinks nothing has changed. But in my world...my whole world has changed. I ask all of the betrayed wives on here...plain and simple....how do you go on? Do you too question whether you should stay or go? I know they say 2-5 years is a normal amount of time to truly heal but truthfully I don't think I can go that long.
Anonymous, I'm sorry I missed this. I sometimes lose track of the various posts and comments. What you're going through tends to be pretty common. Your husband wants to pretend the painful part is over. And there you are, still in pain and feeling like it's invisible to him. You need to have your pain acknowledged and validated. To him, that feels like having to revisit his own pain that he caused this and he wants nothing to do with that. It basically amounts to this, though he likely doesn't realize it: He's putting his comfort above your healing. He stepped out in your marriage and now he wants a second chance. Thing is, he needs to show you that he deserves that second chance. And the best way (and statistics back me up on this) is for him to answer all your questions, to talk to you whenever you need it, to reassure you that he realizes how deep your pain goes and that he is doing everything he can to never cause you that pain again. He needs to admit there's a huge elephant in your marriage. And by admitting it and talking about it and reassuring you, slowly the elephant shrinks in size. It will always be there but it won't take up the whole room. In fact, if you both do the work now, there will be days/weeks/months when the elephant seems to be gone. Are you in counselling? If not, I would urge you to find a marriage counsellor who understands infidelity (not all of them do) and who can guide you both through this. You're in a holding pattern. The crisis is over and now you're just co-existing, side by side. He's likely using sex as a way of feeling close to you. For you, sex is the consequence of feeling close. That, too, is a common dynamic among couples. He needs to learn to talk to you, to be truly intimate, not just sexually intimate. Healing does take a long time but it doesn't just happen. It requires each partner's willingness to go to those uncomfortable places, to learn new skills, to fall down and get back up. Over and over.
Thank you Elle. Did and have you stayed with your husband? Would you ever tell your grown children their father had an affair if you were to divorce? Do they need to know that? I dont want them to think I was the one that wanted to divorce. The reason I may divorce is because he cheated.
Oh my gosh, I'm so sorry. I missed this comment. It is so bizarre that you reminded me of this particular comment. My husband and I had a conversation about this exact thing on Saturday night. I said to him that I wouldn't be surprised if our eldest daughter asked us if there had ever been cheating. She's been asking me questions about things growing up -- along the lines of, "I remember a time when you and Dad were fighting a lot." I've confirmed that yes, we went through a rough time, that we worked through it, etc. So...yes, I've stayed with my husband. My husband and I are not exactly sure what we'd tell our grown children. I said that I wouldn't lie to them but I also agreed that children don't need to know everything about their parents' intimate relationship. The healthiest dynamic is when children are free to love both parents, including adult children. So no, I don't think they "need" to know. And I understand your desire to not look like the bad guy, or even equally to blame. But I nonetheless think, unless kids were privy to the cheating, that you don't need to volunteer the information. If they ask you outright, then I think it's because they genuinely want to know. Then, I might give them broad strokes rather than specific details. But... we each need to decide for ourselves what feels right.
Again I am just over two years since I found out about the affair. I still have such distance between my husband. I feel it and he feels it. I want to have the strength to either rebuild or walk away but I still struggle daily. I have lost so much of me the last two years. I no longer feel there is an "us left. I don't want to leave and cause any pain to my kids. I know they will be fine but I have to live with the decision that I made, whether to stay or go. I probably sound like a broken record but yes that is exactly how I feel.
Anonymous, A lot of get to this phase -- sometimes called "the plain of lethal flatness". The old "me" is gone, the old "us" is gone and nothing has quite come in to fill the gap. I would really encourage you to focus on you right now. Seeking activities that give you joy, that help you feel good about yourself. If your husband is working on himself, then hopefully you'll be seeing changes in him. See if you can take some time together to have fun, as well as talk about the heavy stuff. Sometimes we discover that the marriage just can't be rebuilt. But often, it can. But it does require us to see ourselves and our partner in a new light -- a product of what we've been through but stronger. If you're still feeling uncertain and shakey, then that's your clue that you're not paying enough attention to yourself.
My husband will not talk about the heavy stuff ever. So here I sit still pondering over his affair and how many more women there must of been. I dont think I will have any peace until I know it all. But do I really need to know it all? The only way I see to rid myself of the unknown is to move on...alone. that way I won't be confronted with it every day. For me the elephant in the room has become my husband.
Anonymous, We have a saying on this site: My heartbreak, my rules. If you need to talk about it in order to heal, then he needs to talk about it. If he won't, then he's telling you that his comfort is more important to him than your healing. And that's important information to have. He's asking you to forgive him betraying his marriage vows, putting your health at risk, jeopardizing everything...and he won't talk about it? Show him the blog post: My Letter To Husbands: https://betrayedwivesclub.blogspot.ca/2014/04/my-letter-to-husbands-just-talk-about.html
Is that something I need to know in order to heal? Could it possibly make me feel worse? Which at this point I can't imagine. You can't unknow things once you know them. I spoke with a mediator just after I found out about the affair. Her response was to forget about it..dont dwell on it and certainly stop bringing it up all the time. That only makes it up front all the time jeopardizing any kind of healing. She told me to do a 360 and turn things upside down..take control..stop letting him see me powerless and him always being in control. I think I have made my decision. I just need to be certain its the right one..for me. Because once it is made there will be no coming back.
I'm sorry!! Been swamped with work. You get to decide what you want to know. The key is that you are the one driving this, not him. As for making you feel "worse", it's not about asking for details that will make you feel shittier (which is what we call pain-shopping). It's about making sure you are holding him accountable for the choices he made. So, for instance, you might want to know whether or not he used protection, because that puts your health at risk (get yourself tested regardless of what he says). You might want to know how long it went on, whether there have been other affairs, etc. And I don't agree with your mediator, frankly. You need to talk about it as much as you need to talk about it. If you think it's best to put it behind you, then that's what you do. But if you need to talk about it -- you get triggered by something, or something isn't sitting right and you want clarification -- then you need to feel as though you're free to bring it up without somehow jeopardizing the relationship's recovery. In my experience, the women who feel the most "stuck" on this site are those who feel silenced. They're desperate to have their pain validated and are instead being told to "put it in the past". So...again...YOU get to decide whether and when you talk about it and you get to decide what you want to know. This is about you feeling supported. Your responsibility is to your healing, first and foremost.
Thank you Elle..I am going to do some soul searching and make my decision very shortly. To be honest my feelings have not changed for 2 1/2 years and I now believe it is time for me to move on and begin my life..alone. I am exhausted and feel a deep void in my life right now. Thank you for your support.
I have decided that I no longer want to be married to someone who has lied and cheated on me. Everytine I look at him I am reminded of it. No matter how many I am sorry..no matter how hard he tries..its there. So for that I have decided to end this roller coaster that I am on. I want to live my life..alone. I am ready to make my decisions and decide what I want the rest of my life to look at. No more crutch for me..I just want to be free and that means freeing myself of this poison. So that being said..I am forging ahead..on my own!
Ugh. I'm so sorry I missed this comment. Let us know how you're doing. I think it's perfectly reasonable to just want off this ride. None of us are obliged to stay in a marriage we don't want to be in.
I have been 2 1/2 years from dd. Not sure yet if I will stay or go...I have been dealing with alot of family company iver the summer and my h says to me "dont forget about me" really i m thinking..how selfish is he? Did he not forget about me over the course of his 2 year affair? Is he being selfish? Any advise Elle?
Anonymous, One of the hardest parts of moving forward within the marriage after betrayal is building new, healthier practices on the rubble of the devastated marriage. It's a second marriage to your first husband. When your husband says, please don't forget about me, he's telling you something important. He's making himself vulnerable. What you're hearing is, "my needs matter and yours and everybody else's don't". What you're thinking is "i'm overwhelmed with all this company and you're putting more demands on me". But what if you could separate what he did (cheat) from what he's telling you now (when I don't have some of your attention, I feel lonely/scared/anxious/bored/whatever)? When we're overwhelmed with company/busy-ness, it's easy to fall back into our old habits. But could you try having a conversation with him? To be curious about what he's asking of you? What does "attention" mean to him? And can you communicate that you could use some help with all this company? I think this boils down to just being able to feel safe communicating with each other. He needs to be able to share his feelings with you without fearing being slapped down because of his former actions. And you need to be able to share your feelings and trust that he can hear them.
I find myself living day by day. I am the same anonomys that has been 2 1/2 years since dday. My day by day consists of wondering if I should stay or go..still I am so undecided. I don't want to hurt my grown kids and grandchildren, that is why I stay. Although I know that this is not fulfilling my needs. I feel so trapped and not in control. I don't enjoy sex anymore at all., it seems like it just isn't intimate anymore, I would just as soon not even go there. But for him, he is constantly, and I mean constantly wanting sex, it is to the point that I think he has a serious problem with it. I just want to sleep soundly at night, but no, I am always awoken by his need for sex. I have told him that I don't want to have sex every day, quite frankly I could care less if I ever had sex again! It is not enjoyable for me, it always, even after all of this time, makes me think of his affair. I am so tired, emotionally drained and just want to end this relationship, but yet, here I am, still holding on. Making my life (and I am sure his) unpleasant for the most part. I don't want to let my guard down ever again, so now this has become my normal. What a waste of the past 2 1/2 years. I believe I should of ended it and left way back then. So here I sit, undecided still....any help?
Everything you are writing indicates that you are in a relationship where your needs don't matter. I suspect that fear is a huge reason you're staying. Don't put this on your adult children/grandchildren. Would you encourage them to stay in a relationship in which they are disrespected and shown that they don't matter? Because by staying, that's the message you're sending. If you're not in therapy, I strongly encourage you to find a therapist who can help you find the strength to make a choice. If you stay, then make sure it's because he is committed to becoming a better husband, not because you think it will make your family sad. You do not have to live your life to please others. He cheated but you are the one cheating yourself now. By allowing yourself to be disrespected, by not respecting yourself enough to draw strong clear boundaries. I know it's not when we've lived a lifetime without doing that. But that's where a therapist comes in. He/she can teach you how to respect yourself and how to ensure that others do too. You "believe" you should have ended it then. So...what are you waiting for? Call a therapist, make an appointment and begin reclaiming your life.
Love this!! We are all ENOUGH! No matter what!
ReplyDeleteHere's a good song - "Enough" by The Mrs. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I4_USW-FgKo I like to blare this one in my car or just here at home anytime I need a good pick-me-up!
"I know I'm enough."
Hugs
I need this reminder often. Because I'm feeling not enough a whole bunch right now.
ReplyDeleteHey SS1. I hear you. I'm right there beside you with these feelings.
DeleteMuch love and hugs
Gabby xo
I believe this more than ever. What I find a challenge is even during the "affair years" my husband would say I was too good for him and I deserved better. I always thought oh that is so nice and he was being sweet, supportive and positive. Now I know he did mean it in a major way. And he still says the same thing. I know there is new meaning behind it but it does make me get a knot in my stomach hearing it now.
ReplyDeleteI never thought I was as strong as I am. It is one major positive to come out of all of this.
Takes a while to get here!!! Without having married the fool I did and going through this awful shit pool i was thrown in I would never have seen with such clarity the enoughness I have. The selfishness of others is NOT my baggage. You treat me poorly it is your fault... not because I deserve it. I was so blind to this while he abused me emotionally during the affair. And then after discovery to see how all my efforts were wasted on such a fool of a man-boy. I build a life with someone that had the emotional maturity of a 3 year old. What does an equal partnership look like?? What does it feel like?? How do you get there?? Do we have a life together after the craziness of babies is over and they all 3 are grown up and then move out? We will be left alone. Together. That is scary. How will it all go for us...My solution right now is to take it day by day. Putting my trust in God and time. After affair We still have to climb over the mountains life gives us together... only now we have an extra load to carry getting over the insanely stupid betrayal. Thanks for the extra weight man-boy. (Bitterness vented)
ReplyDeleteI am enjoying my new found enoughness and less triggered days. Knowing that I'm not alone fighting my own mind for peace. I see my own thoughts written out again and again in these posts. LLP did an amazing job suming up all the depressing thoughts we fight. But we are SO enough. Sucks to be him and the whore who clearly doesn't get it. Imagine the self hate and insecurities inside them. Gross. It does put a wicked smile on my face however because I struggled for so long thinking i was lesser then her. I would never ever EVER trade places with her. Even if he had left me. And I take a lot of happiness from that. I like me. :)
Blindsided.
Blindsided, I have asked myself many of those questions especially about why are we together and does it make sense for the future beyond kids. My husband is 100% in and more dedicated than ever. Now I feel like is this right for me?? Is this what I want "forever". I do this with all aspects of my life. I am less of a day to day person and more big picture. My husband is very day to day and it helped him get through his affair years I think. He only focused on what was in front of him not anything else. I need to find a healthy balance between the two perspectives. Also I have told him often that I am glad this came out now. I am not sure we would have lasted and even if he was not having any affairs the shame and distance he created would have made our life as empty nesters horrible. Also as we approach the teen years it is good we are closer than ever. It is way more demanding than when they were little. Our kids are great but way more academically is at stake, activities are draining, driving them everywhere, social needs, emotional needs it is so much more intense than stressing about a cold or if they missed a nap or had a bad night of sleep. It is all good but I try to remind myself of these things daily.
DeleteI agree with everything in your last paragraph! For the 10 years he was having his sporadic affairs I was always wondering what is wrong with him. It was subtle since his encounters were so sporadic. There was one aha moment for me 3 years before dday. My husband went on an extended trip with friends. It was the first time he had been gone longer than three nights. I remember him calling and I honestly did not care to talk with him. I was so enjoying time by myself and with the kids. He was so bothered when we said hi but got to run. It hit me during those 8-10 days that it was not me. It was 100% him that was making our lives miserable and unhappy and it had nothing to do with me. We were all so happy with him gone. I never took the leap to leave him and maybe I should have. From that point forward I really did what I wanted. I do not think that sat well with him. He ended the affairs on his own 15 months before dday. He was strongly considering leaving me and just saying it was not working out but not owning up to anything he did so he could as he has told me "save face" and still look like the "good guy". I feel most sad for him and the ow. He is really carrying around a huge burden and flaw that I am not sure he will ever fully recover from. I agree I would never trade places with him or the ow. I have always been able to put my head on my pillow and know that I have done my best and been honest. I have always been true to myself. He was lost and immature. So sad.
Hopeful: oh boy yes!! Dido!! With three babies waking up every hour nursing or a pee bed or a lost blanket or a bad dream I got no sleep and was drained. But it got to the point when I didn't even care if he was gone because of his attitude. He was no help to me anyways!! They push him away now when he tries to be with them. They tell him they don't Like him that they want him to go back to work or they wish he was me. It kills him. He gets angry at the constant rejection sometimes... but after months of neglecting them and being away and months of seeing me in the state I was in after d day how could they not figure something out and point some of their own frustrations at someone? They are human as well, and have part of me and him... the anger the charm the carung the selfishness... they have the good and the bad as we do. It's been over a year of their life. Im urging him to have patience with them as I have had with him. "I regret the patience I had with my kids when they were young" said no parent ever.
DeletePS I would take baby age over teen years ANY day. I keep telling them to stop growing but two have birthdays this month and they refuse not to celebrate them for the sake of my happiness in not seeing them get older. How selfish of them (sarcasm) lol. Teen years terrify me. I have huge anxiety over it. I'm in the high schools for work and it's crazy different from my days roaming the halls. I can't imagine what it will be like for them. I'm a huge mama bear. I'm not looking forward to taking a seat on the bench as they start to figure out who they are. But im doing my very best to give them a solid foundation to fall on dispite the sludge hammer my husband took to it.
I still LOVE you hun despite what happened even if I tell you otherwise. If you are reading my posts still I know ypu have been and i want you to keep reading. Im not writing for you I never was. Im writing for ME. As difficult as it is to read this is my truth. This is what is inside me. Ignore My bad writing and all :) You dont have to agree 100 percent... but can't you at least accept that this is how I feel and that perhaps your actions can pursuayed me to think more where you are at? Certainly anger towards me will never solve our issues and I agree that my anger will not either. I need you to help me when I fall into the anger trap and I will try to do the same. There are lots of strong amazing women who have stuck it out with their spouses on here. Their advice is well founded. We will get through this so much stronger if you can open up to change fully. And it starts with TRUTH. We need truth to be our foundation for trust and love to grow. I love our family. We have the best family in the world. It's all I ever wanted in this world. I'll keep climbing this mountain for our family if you are beside me.
Blindsided.
Blindsided, Yes, yes, yes! One thing that is so critical and my husband and I now reflect on it now is that thankfully it all happened and came out when it did. We are a unified front and dealing with teen issues even the good ones is hard. Like you said starting to let them go and figure out things on their own. Yikes!! And for us to be on the same page is the best. Also last night my husband got into a disagreement/fight with my youngest (his twin more than ever..) well I had some insights after the fact. And I shared them with him in a nice way but he took them and there was zero part of him that was defensive. That would have never happened pre dday or even post dday early on. We all have issues and I am not perfect but by nature I am more insightful and with those insights I work to change and reflect and also being a mom I think that comes with it too. It was really a testament of how far he especially had come. In the past that would have never gotten addressed or been a big fight.
DeleteI also think it is important for husbands to realize they can be part of the healing process. This is hard for them. My husband struggles so much but there is satisfaction and healing that comes with that. It takes a ton of work and time but it is worth it.
My kids don't know anything really. They did notice my husband being around more and involved more and us spending more time together. But they see it as a good thing. And we have always tried to be honest that in any relationship/marriage there are disagreements and rough times that need to be worked through. Saying all of that many movies we have seen lately have betrayal themes. One we were watching with our kids and they hammered the man in the story who was cheating on his wife. This really has hit him hard. He broke down over the holidays after that. I think he has a lot to work through still. I keep supporting his goal of living a transparent life and one he is proud of as a husband and father.
Keep up all the hard work!!
Good reminder, I know I'm enough for me. I even like myself. I feel confident about me. Then why don't feel like I'm enough for him? What is the difference? I think of all the lies he told well after DD about the affair. Here are random thoughts on being enough for him which drive me crazy nutty. Of course sex was better with her, he lied about so much why would he say it was better? He would have to be a bigger dumb shit to say it was better. So next time he says, this is the best sex I ever had. I'm going to say - I don't believe you. You have been with so many women how can I be the best? I married you when I was 25. He says it is the emotional connection. Whatever. I know I sound cynical but isn't that part of questioning? Not really falling hook, line and sinker but asking for clarification? Does it make a difference? What difference does it make? Somehow and I don't know why yet, it does make a difference to me. There isn't anything I can do about it. I guess I can handle MORE honesty now. Back in year one or two - just tell me anything that makes me feel better. Now that I'm enough, I'm ready to handle more truth. I seek more truth from him. Not what HE thinks is best for me. I'm enough so I'm ready to decide what is best for me. I want to rock the damn boat. I want to rock it hard and know it is real. So this year he is going to be in a rocky boat. I'm ready for the real truth from him. I'm not going to allow him to decided what is best for me. He did a shitty job of it in the past. He isn't the best decision maker for me. So to circle back to my original thought, I need to take out my big red bullshit meter again, rock the boat of truth. On the other hand rocking the boat means I'm truthful with him as well. Some women say I know enough. Well I still don't know the truth and it bugs the shit out of me therefore I don't know if I'm enough for him? I want the person I'm spending my life seconds, minutes, hours, days and years on are based on something that is real. I don't know what it is like to be married to someone who thinks enough of marriage not to cheat. I will never know what that feels like. So at least I deserve to know what it is like to married to someone who will tell me the truth. What pleasure do I derive out of testing him? It is called learning to trust again. Even a judge won't listen to someone who has perjured themselves, they go to jail. Can an embezzler ever get a job again? Can an adultery ever be a good H again?
ReplyDeleteTo SS1 - my heart goes out to you. I wish I had a wand and was your fairy god mother. You make think I'm over the edge but I do believe in guardian angels. I have seen my kids get out of falling, run over, mortal type situations not to believe in angles that intervene from time to time. I pray for your strength, acceptance and daughter. You are enough in many ways - can I adopt you?
LLP I love your fire! Rocking the boat feels good sometimes, especially when its involves putting ourselves first. :) I will take all offers of fairy god mothers, angels and adoption! Are you even old enough to be my mother? I doubt it. We can adopt each other as sisters! I loved reading what you wrote. Felt like the hug I was really needing.
DeleteTwins Twice - are you doing ok?
ReplyDeleteI'm going to give him this list of rock the boat questions to answer when he feels he has answers. Although it doesn't look it, I think I need this so I won't wake up with nightmares of him and her laughing at me.
ReplyDeleteWhy did you respect the idea of marriage, vows in the first place? Why didn’t you want to protect your marriage?
Did you ever think of me or our family while you were with her?
Why didn’t you trust me enough to share your hatred/dissatisfaction/resentment for me before you allowed yourself to be left vulnerable in so many ways? (work, family, home, STD, reputation)
What lies did K tell you?
What lies did you tell K?
How did feel trying to put our marriage back together and lying at the same time?
What did you think would happen if I caught you lying while trying to recover our marriage?
Why did you think you knew what was best for me by withholding the entire truth?
Why did you feel like you had to take care of her, entertain her, feel sorry for her? (allowing her into our home, showing her our farm, let her sit on your lap and cry, consoling her, giving her money, giving her gifts?) Why did you never see me wanting the same thing? What allowed you to be that way with her and not me ever in our married life?
Why would you have more loyalty to K than me?
How could you not think of the consequences?
What were you like when you were with her compared to how you are now?
Why the sudden passion for me once you got caught?
How could you do this if you loved me?
Did you compare us?
Did you ever do anything sexual with her that you have not done with me? I mean anything that has to do with touching each other.
Were you sexually adventurous with K?
Did you lie when you said the sex could have been telephone sex? I can see why you wouldn’t want to tell me at the beginning it was a great relationship with great sex.
Why did you put so much value on the sexual attention?
Why keep going back?
Did you think about K when you were intimate with me?
I know the affair was sexual but do you consider your long-term affair an emotion one too?
LLP YOU ARE ME. I lived that thought line. It wrecked me. It changed everything I ever believed in. LLP I want so desperately for you to have peace. I hate you are feeling this pain. I hate we are all here... But please please please don't do what i have done emotionally to myself... or maybe it is necessary to get over I don't know.
DeleteI hated big. I hated him. I hated everything. I hated our car because it took him to her. I hated his job it lead him out of town. I hated the food I cooked our family because I wondered if she cooked that for him. I couldn't stand my head. I was tortured. The hate was so intense. I am also a detail person.. I had to know it all. And I'm glad I know most... I bet like 80%. Im no longer obessive and I think time and anti depressants helped rid me of the obessesive thoughts that just would not go away. i do still get bothered but its not as big. It was as if a huge pressure was in me to ask these questions that came in my head. Even if i tried to avoid it would come back stronger. I found out many details this way. My husband was and is a very sick man with what he was able to pull off. If everyone knew what he did... the details... there would not be a person in his life that would look at him the same. My affair was also very emotional and he treated her better then he ever treated me pre affair. But Elle and these women helped me so much to see that My husband did not do this to me personally but to himself. He was after the image he saw of himself when he looked at her. She was "hotter" then is fat wife and she wanted him. That fed his self hating image and he wanted more because at the time, it looked like this was what he was missing... that somehow he would have more value if someone else wanted him. Selfishness to its core. I feel sorry for him. Seriously. I know I chose To be with him. It's not like I'm hideous or didn't have options. I put up with his shitty behaviour because i loved him, our family, and the life we built. I hoped he could see what was lacking in himself and i was prepared to give him time to get there. This fat ugly wife was not prepared to have him choose a whore of a woman for 5 months to get there... but that is what happened. Life happened. He fucked up becuase he doesnt have the foundation that i do. He is blind. I'm now helping him see. And PS...the affair diet has taken me down to my university weight of 115!! I just had a baby that prick. Marriage is a choice. Not a destiny soul mate bullshit. You choose each other dispite other options... because to have a partner in life comes with so many more benefits then jumping from one bed to another. To know you have done this to your family... the one thing that does give him TRUE joy in his life is killer on him. He knows this now finally. I pray yours does too... that he regrets this to his core and is fueled with a desire to overcome his own issues to figure out how he went so terribly wrong.
Blindsided.
I wanted to say what I learned about the "better" sex issue. I was stuck on the better factor. I've only had him... that's it. I'm not experienced or know anything. Im kind a prude i guess? She is a whore. So clearly the sex was different. Better? It's all in the context. Think about this. When you are with a man sexually, it is pleasing sure. But do you find happiness in It? Is there joy after the sex is over? No. It is a lust driven action. A momentary good feeling. You find joy and happiness in safety, compassion, forgiveness, commitment and all of that is love. The sex is like dessert. One day you could really like chocolate cake... then you get sick of it and cheese cake is your preference but it's all the same, a moment pleasure then once eaten gone. No joy, no life happiness. It's meaningless. If he has guilt it will taint any memory he has with her. She is a loser. She knows It, he knows it and you know it. She is NO BETTER. As one person pointed out to me on here and it was one of my ah-ha moments... the OW "is as ugly as sin". I would like to add to you that: so was their sex.
DeleteHugs LLP. Your posts kicks ass...you know how to put all my rambling thoughts down better then if I had 100 000 characters to write within. Elle you really gotta figure out a way to extend our limits on posting lol nvm I just talk to much. :)
Blindsided.
I finally made it past the 1st year of Dday #1, in December. It was an emotional roller coaster of a year. If it wasn't for my sisters and this site, idk where I would be right now. I'm 31 yrs old, married for 12 yrs. I believe his random online hook ups began a few years back,but could be more. Of course he won't say BC he thinks I'll get hurt more than I already have-which is not possible. There are some things that I can't get over (besides the obvious)such as him having sex in the family van where our kids sit! I've been trying VERY hard to keep my emotions in check and portray a happy family for our kids sake. I wish I can talk to my mom about it but it would break her and I don't want to do that to her. Every time I look at his face it's all I think about, but when he asks what's wrong, why I'm looking at him, I say I'm just admiring his handsome features!lol (Eyeroll). I'm carrying a ton in my heart but noone knows. The 4 people I've told keep telling me how strong I am, but they don't know how broken I am on the inside.
ReplyDeleteDear Angie...having a D day anniversary at this time of year must be difficult.Please remember that you have the right to ask any and all questions you have.Only you can decide if the answers are painful or not. I told my H that if he wanted to stay with me be has to be 100% forth coming.If he asks you why you are staring into his eyes tell him to are trying to find the man who you fell in love with.1 am 2+ years out and I still do this.Hugs to you my friend
ReplyDeleteI am coming up to two years since I found out about my h sexual affair with a woman over two years. Once I found out about the affair I found out he was sexting two other women. We have been married for 37 years. I let him stay for a "second chance" although he has already used up his chances. I question myself everyday. I stay for my family. I am in a very lonely relationship and each and every month I give myself another deadline to leave. The deadline comes and goes and here I am...still here. What makes me stay? I don't trust him anymore and not sure if time will help with that. This has taken a toll on me big time and I don't know if tbis is where I want to be. Because of these feelings I struggle daily so scared I will be blindsided once again. Any help and advise?
ReplyDeleteAnonymous,
DeleteI would strongly urge you to find a counsellor who can help you understand your own reluctance to leave. We often stay out of fear. The unknown can feel terrifying, especially when we're feeling beaten down and exhausted. But you deserve better than this. You deserve to feel emotionally safe, to feel good about who you are and your role in the world. And you can't get that when you're in a relationship in which you feel invisible and emotionally unsafe.
Start with a counsellor. Share here too. So many of us have been where you are and can help you draw the roadmap you need to a better life. But start by knowing it's possible. That you can create something better for yourself.
Thank you Elle. I guess I stay out of fear as I get older. I also fear that my kids will abandon me if they ever knew for whatever reason. He has caused me so much emotional pain and yet can carry on day to day. His mother said to me the other day...I am so lucky to have him as my husband..he is a mommys boy and those are the best to keep. I almost started to cry and wanted to tell her that he is not the mommys boy she thinks he is. She was quite smitten about it. But I just nodded. A counsellor for me is too expensive..right now anyways.
ReplyDeleteI'm so sorry for the pain you're in. Consider finding a counsellor who has a sliding pay scale. Or try the Infidelity Counselling Network -- the link is on the right side column of this site. It's a pay-what-you-can system and the women are trained peer mentors. I just think you need someone to help you through this. It's no way to go through life.
DeleteI agree it is no way to go through life. Some say an affair will either break a marriage or make a marriage stronger. I do not feel my marriage has gotten stronger. Answer this..how do you carry on without the daily struggle of knowing your husband slept with another woman? How do any betrayed wives accept this and why do we think its okay to stay and work it out. Why does a husband need to be cottled and praised about absolutely eveything. I don't get and never have gotten any of that during my entire 37years of marriage. Maybe this is a sign for me to move on and out and see what my life is like with just me. I am tired of hearing how it will make me stronger. I don't feel strong about staying and letting him think I will never leave him. I don't believe I will ever be over this and I know I don't know the whole story of all the women he has been with and that is something I just can't live with.
ReplyDeleteIt isn't the affair that either makes a marriage stronger or fall apart, it's the RESPONSE to the affair. It takes a whole lot of work to rebuild a marriage after infidelity. And if your husband isn't interested in doing the work, then nothing will improve. Staying in a marriage after infidelity is not at all about being "okay" with it. It's about being willing to give someone – WHO IS SHOWING YOU THAT HE DESERVES IT – a second chance. Nobody should require being coddled and praised about everything -- that's not a marriage, it's tyranny.
DeleteUltimately, Anonymous, it's up to you how you proceed. But, again, I urge to try and find a counsellor who you can afford or give the Infidelity Counselling Network a try. You deserve to heal from this pain, no matter whether you stay or leave.
That is why I dont have a counsellor..the one person I did talk with told me it either makes or breaks. My husband appears to be willing to do anything so I dont toss him to the curb but he has lied so much and been able to hide it..how do I really know he is being truthful? Perhaps I am the one that doesnt want to make the effort anymore..
ReplyDeleteI think that sometimes is the case. We're so beaten down by the lies and the betrayal that it feels impossible to trust again. But that is why I think counselling is so crucial for you. Whether or not you stay or go, YOU need to heal from this. You need to find a way to move forward, with or without him, in a way that allows you to find joy in life again.
DeleteUntil you decide whether or not you want to make the effort, you can focus on YOU, not the marriage, not him. I really hope you'll do this for yourself.
I need to get past the fact thst if I do leave it will hurt alot of my family. I know I shouldn't worry about what people think but I worry about how my children who are now 30 years old and have families of their own will take it. My h told me if I decide to leave..everyone will adjust and move on with their lives. I will move on and so will he. It just breaks my heart to have all of this thrown in my face. And left to try and pick up the pieces and try to fit them back together.
ReplyDeleteI think we too often overestimate our own control and underestimate others' resilience. I suspect your children want you to do what's right for you, even if it means experiencing some pain for them. They're adults. By living a life according to your own value system, you're modelling to them what that looks like. If, God forbid, they ever find themselves in the same situation, would't you want them to do what felt right to them, rather than trying to spare others? It isn't selfish to live by your values. It's self-respect.
DeleteI should ask how do I get past all of this and move on? With or without him? The first six months after I found put he was very loving and attentive and warm. Now not so much...I feel he may have given up on me not really understandings how traumatic tbis has been for me. So for a year and a half I have not felt his warmth therefore I have not returned it. He is the one that needs to change not me. Am I right or delerious?
ReplyDeleteAnonymous,
DeleteYes, he needs to change. But you have absolutely no control over whether he does. What you can control is you. And so that's where you need to focus. What do YOU want that is within your control? Are you in therapy? If not, I would encourage you to find someone who can help you find your way through this and process the pain. Betrayal is trauma. And by healing yourself, you're better able to set boundaries. He can either learn to respect them (for instance, a boundary might be, I cannot stay in this relationship if you won't seek therapy individually or as a couple) or he's telling you he's not willing to change. Either way, it makes your path far more clear rather than passively waiting for him to take responsibility for himself and his choices.
My finances are going to play a big factor if I leave. Its easy to stay because of that. I m approaching 60 years old..not alot of employment out there. We are self employed and he seems reluctant to take on new work. I wonder if that is a plan of his. If he is not working..no money for me. These are all the things I think of. I think he is always making a plan.
ReplyDeleteI am unable to support myself. I do not have a career. I m almost 60 years old. What does one do then? Just give it all up and struggle?
ReplyDeleteAny more thoughts?
ReplyDeleteI am the same anonomys as above. Just passed the 2 year since d day. I still ponder every day to stay or go..why can't I stop this madness? I will ask my husband if he truly wants to be in this relationship..does he truly love me. He says yes then asks "what up"? Its like whenever I ask him that he thinks something is going on. He will not talk about any feelings. We are both on edge all the time...like we are "just here". "Just together". Almost every morning he wakes me up for sex....I don't sometimes want to have sex right then and there. He just seems to always want it. I tell him there is more to marriage than just sex. I know it is important in a relationship but that also puts me back into his affair. I feel like he thinks nothing has changed. But in my world...my whole world has changed. I ask all of the betrayed wives on here...plain and simple....how do you go on? Do you too question whether you should stay or go? I know they say 2-5 years is a normal amount of time to truly heal but truthfully I don't think I can go that long.
ReplyDeleteAny more thoughts Elle?
ReplyDeleteAnonymous,
DeleteI'm sorry I missed this. I sometimes lose track of the various posts and comments.
What you're going through tends to be pretty common. Your husband wants to pretend the painful part is over. And there you are, still in pain and feeling like it's invisible to him. You need to have your pain acknowledged and validated. To him, that feels like having to revisit his own pain that he caused this and he wants nothing to do with that. It basically amounts to this, though he likely doesn't realize it: He's putting his comfort above your healing.
He stepped out in your marriage and now he wants a second chance. Thing is, he needs to show you that he deserves that second chance. And the best way (and statistics back me up on this) is for him to answer all your questions, to talk to you whenever you need it, to reassure you that he realizes how deep your pain goes and that he is doing everything he can to never cause you that pain again. He needs to admit there's a huge elephant in your marriage. And by admitting it and talking about it and reassuring you, slowly the elephant shrinks in size. It will always be there but it won't take up the whole room. In fact, if you both do the work now, there will be days/weeks/months when the elephant seems to be gone.
Are you in counselling? If not, I would urge you to find a marriage counsellor who understands infidelity (not all of them do) and who can guide you both through this. You're in a holding pattern. The crisis is over and now you're just co-existing, side by side. He's likely using sex as a way of feeling close to you. For you, sex is the consequence of feeling close. That, too, is a common dynamic among couples.
He needs to learn to talk to you, to be truly intimate, not just sexually intimate.
Healing does take a long time but it doesn't just happen. It requires each partner's willingness to go to those uncomfortable places, to learn new skills, to fall down and get back up. Over and over.
Thank you Elle. Did and have you stayed with your husband? Would you ever tell your grown children their father had an affair if you were to divorce? Do they need to know that? I dont want them to think I was the one that wanted to divorce. The reason I may divorce is because he cheated.
ReplyDeleteOh my gosh, I'm so sorry. I missed this comment.
DeleteIt is so bizarre that you reminded me of this particular comment. My husband and I had a conversation about this exact thing on Saturday night. I said to him that I wouldn't be surprised if our eldest daughter asked us if there had ever been cheating. She's been asking me questions about things growing up -- along the lines of, "I remember a time when you and Dad were fighting a lot." I've confirmed that yes, we went through a rough time, that we worked through it, etc.
So...yes, I've stayed with my husband. My husband and I are not exactly sure what we'd tell our grown children. I said that I wouldn't lie to them but I also agreed that children don't need to know everything about their parents' intimate relationship.
The healthiest dynamic is when children are free to love both parents, including adult children. So no, I don't think they "need" to know. And I understand your desire to not look like the bad guy, or even equally to blame. But I nonetheless think, unless kids were privy to the cheating, that you don't need to volunteer the information. If they ask you outright, then I think it's because they genuinely want to know. Then, I might give them broad strokes rather than specific details.
But... we each need to decide for ourselves what feels right.
Again I am just over two years since I found out about the affair. I still have such distance between my husband. I feel it and he feels it. I want to have the strength to either rebuild or walk away but I still struggle daily. I have lost so much of me the last two years. I no longer feel there is an "us left. I don't want to leave and cause any pain to my kids. I know they will be fine but I have to live with the decision that I made, whether to stay or go. I probably sound like a broken record but yes that is exactly how I feel.
ReplyDeleteAnonymous,
DeleteA lot of get to this phase -- sometimes called "the plain of lethal flatness". The old "me" is gone, the old "us" is gone and nothing has quite come in to fill the gap.
I would really encourage you to focus on you right now. Seeking activities that give you joy, that help you feel good about yourself. If your husband is working on himself, then hopefully you'll be seeing changes in him. See if you can take some time together to have fun, as well as talk about the heavy stuff.
Sometimes we discover that the marriage just can't be rebuilt. But often, it can. But it does require us to see ourselves and our partner in a new light -- a product of what we've been through but stronger.
If you're still feeling uncertain and shakey, then that's your clue that you're not paying enough attention to yourself.
My husband will not talk about the heavy stuff ever. So here I sit still pondering over his affair and how many more women there must of been. I dont think I will have any peace until I know it all. But do I really need to know it all? The only way I see to rid myself of the unknown is to move on...alone. that way I won't be confronted with it every day. For me the elephant in the room has become my husband.
ReplyDeleteAnonymous, We have a saying on this site: My heartbreak, my rules. If you need to talk about it in order to heal, then he needs to talk about it. If he won't, then he's telling you that his comfort is more important to him than your healing. And that's important information to have.
DeleteHe's asking you to forgive him betraying his marriage vows, putting your health at risk, jeopardizing everything...and he won't talk about it? Show him the blog post: My Letter To Husbands: https://betrayedwivesclub.blogspot.ca/2014/04/my-letter-to-husbands-just-talk-about.html
Is that something I need to know in order to heal? Could it possibly make me feel worse? Which at this point I can't imagine. You can't unknow things once you know them. I spoke with a mediator just after I found out about the affair. Her response was to forget about it..dont dwell on it and certainly stop bringing it up all the time. That only makes it up front all the time jeopardizing any kind of healing. She told me to do a 360 and turn things upside down..take control..stop letting him see me powerless and him always being in control. I think I have made my decision. I just need to be certain its the right one..for me. Because once it is made there will be no coming back.
ReplyDeleteElle?
ReplyDeleteI'm sorry!! Been swamped with work.
DeleteYou get to decide what you want to know. The key is that you are the one driving this, not him.
As for making you feel "worse", it's not about asking for details that will make you feel shittier (which is what we call pain-shopping). It's about making sure you are holding him accountable for the choices he made. So, for instance, you might want to know whether or not he used protection, because that puts your health at risk (get yourself tested regardless of what he says). You might want to know how long it went on, whether there have been other affairs, etc.
And I don't agree with your mediator, frankly. You need to talk about it as much as you need to talk about it. If you think it's best to put it behind you, then that's what you do. But if you need to talk about it -- you get triggered by something, or something isn't sitting right and you want clarification -- then you need to feel as though you're free to bring it up without somehow jeopardizing the relationship's recovery. In my experience, the women who feel the most "stuck" on this site are those who feel silenced. They're desperate to have their pain validated and are instead being told to "put it in the past".
So...again...YOU get to decide whether and when you talk about it and you get to decide what you want to know. This is about you feeling supported. Your responsibility is to your healing, first and foremost.
Thank you Elle..I am going to do some soul searching and make my decision very shortly. To be honest my feelings have not changed for 2 1/2 years and I now believe it is time for me to move on and begin my life..alone. I am exhausted and feel a deep void in my life right now. Thank you for your support.
ReplyDeleteI have decided that I no longer want to be married to someone who has lied and cheated on me. Everytine I look at him I am reminded of it. No matter how many I am sorry..no matter how hard he tries..its there. So for that I have decided to end this roller coaster that I am on. I want to live my life..alone. I am ready to make my decisions and decide what I want the rest of my life to look at. No more crutch for me..I just want to be free and that means freeing myself of this poison. So that being said..I am forging ahead..on my own!
ReplyDeleteUgh. I'm so sorry I missed this comment. Let us know how you're doing. I think it's perfectly reasonable to just want off this ride. None of us are obliged to stay in a marriage we don't want to be in.
DeleteI have been 2 1/2 years from dd. Not sure yet if I will stay or go...I have been dealing with alot of family company iver the summer and my h says to me "dont forget about me" really i m thinking..how selfish is he? Did he not forget about me over the course of his 2 year affair? Is he being selfish? Any advise Elle?
ReplyDeleteAnonymous,
DeleteOne of the hardest parts of moving forward within the marriage after betrayal is building new, healthier practices on the rubble of the devastated marriage. It's a second marriage to your first husband.
When your husband says, please don't forget about me, he's telling you something important. He's making himself vulnerable. What you're hearing is, "my needs matter and yours and everybody else's don't". What you're thinking is "i'm overwhelmed with all this company and you're putting more demands on me". But what if you could separate what he did (cheat) from what he's telling you now (when I don't have some of your attention, I feel lonely/scared/anxious/bored/whatever)? When we're overwhelmed with company/busy-ness, it's easy to fall back into our old habits. But could you try having a conversation with him? To be curious about what he's asking of you? What does "attention" mean to him? And can you communicate that you could use some help with all this company?
I think this boils down to just being able to feel safe communicating with each other. He needs to be able to share his feelings with you without fearing being slapped down because of his former actions. And you need to be able to share your feelings and trust that he can hear them.
I find myself living day by day. I am the same anonomys that has been 2 1/2 years since dday. My day by day consists of wondering if I should stay or go..still I am so undecided. I don't want to hurt my grown kids and grandchildren, that is why I stay. Although I know that this is not fulfilling my needs. I feel so trapped and not in control. I don't enjoy sex anymore at all., it seems like it just isn't intimate anymore, I would just as soon not even go there. But for him, he is constantly, and I mean constantly wanting sex, it is to the point that I think he has a serious problem with it. I just want to sleep soundly at night, but no, I am always awoken by his need for sex. I have told him that I don't want to have sex every day, quite frankly I could care less if I ever had sex again! It is not enjoyable for me, it always, even after all of this time, makes me think of his affair. I am so tired, emotionally drained and just want to end this relationship, but yet, here I am, still holding on. Making my life (and I am sure his) unpleasant for the most part. I don't want to let my guard down ever again, so now this has become my normal. What a waste of the past 2 1/2 years. I believe I should of ended it and left way back then. So here I sit, undecided still....any help?
ReplyDeleteEverything you are writing indicates that you are in a relationship where your needs don't matter. I suspect that fear is a huge reason you're staying. Don't put this on your adult children/grandchildren. Would you encourage them to stay in a relationship in which they are disrespected and shown that they don't matter? Because by staying, that's the message you're sending.
DeleteIf you're not in therapy, I strongly encourage you to find a therapist who can help you find the strength to make a choice. If you stay, then make sure it's because he is committed to becoming a better husband, not because you think it will make your family sad. You do not have to live your life to please others. He cheated but you are the one cheating yourself now. By allowing yourself to be disrespected, by not respecting yourself enough to draw strong clear boundaries. I know it's not when we've lived a lifetime without doing that. But that's where a therapist comes in. He/she can teach you how to respect yourself and how to ensure that others do too.
You "believe" you should have ended it then. So...what are you waiting for? Call a therapist, make an appointment and begin reclaiming your life.
You are right
ReplyDelete