Monday, December 7, 2020

Here's what betrayed wives have to say about whether "strong" women leave...

Last week, Susan, one of our secret sisters, noted how much difficulty she's having looking herself in the eye. She feels ashamed at staying with her unfaithful husband. She feels pathetic and weak and like, if she had any dignity, she would be out the door.

It's a state I'm familiar with. I, too, spent many weeks/months beating myself up for staying. I told myself I was staying for the kids, at least for now. I told myself that I could leave any time (and I could!). I told myself I just needed to rest until I felt ready to leave.

And all of this was true. But it wasn't the whole story. Because underscoring all those things I was telling myself was this truth: I wanted to stay.

Wanting to stay in a marriage with someone who cheated on you is, shall we say, frowned on in our culture. We all know the tropes: Cheaters are assholes who must pay for what they did. Women who stay are those who agree to "look the other way", who "put up with it". Men who aren't left humiliated are undoubtedly going to do it again because they haven't paid a price for their sins. It's baked into our culture, our songs, our stories.

It's wrong.

We see it here all the time. Incredible strong women who are willing to give their partners another chance but under the strict maxim, "My heartbreak, my rules."

I asked these incredible women to share with Susan how they see their choice to stay (or leave). As usual, they showed up and revealed their wisdom, their integrity and their compassion.

So, to Susan, and anyone else struggling to reconcile their desire to stay with their belief (whether their own or culturally prescribed) that strong women leave...read on:

💪  Strong women listen to their own hearts and voice. Its the hardest thing I have ever done.

❤️  There's no one answer. All the details matter. Healthy women deal with whatever life throws them. No one wants to be betrayed but it happens. Some can move on with, some not. Either is okay.

💪 Perfect. You have to get to know yourself, what you think you can do, and what your spouse is capable of in terms of change. It’s hard. But so is leaving.

❤️  I stayed and i am now one of the strongest women i know. Leaving would have made me strong too , single and strong. But married with my family in tact took just as much strength.

💪  It takes a strong woman not make a knee jerk decision to leave.

A mature adult lets the dust settle and makes a decision that is right for her (& her kids).

💪  Staying also takes a lot strength. It’s just focused differently then leaving. There is nothing weak in trying to figure out what is right for yourself after your world has been blown apart. Better clearer choices can be made as the dust settles.

Strong women are the ones who find & know their self worth, regardless of whether they stay or leave.

💪 Strong people face the truth and make the right decision for them.

I would tell her that having a big heart and deep love for her SO isn’t weakness. It takes strength to stay and face the pain, and work through it day after day. It takes strength to still try and see the good in this person. And It also takes strength to leave.

💪 My husband's AP's family and friends told me I was dumb. I stayed with a cheater. She tried everything to break up our family knowing how hard it was for me to stay. I had to forgive the ultimate sin and take everyone's crap and swallow it. That takes strength. It takes someone brave and bold to do the hardest thing. And I didn't settle. I made the choice. I didn't just go back because I didn't have any other options. I made the choice because it is what was right for me. And anyone who judges is a c@#t.

❤️  She definitely should not “put up with it”. To stay, she needs to go for recovery...and that’s not putting up with it. It’s staying with a plan. It takes strength & courage as you all know. Courage to face society’s & oneself’s judgement and to heal with the one who hurt her...

💪  I think it takes a very strong woman/man to stay and put in the work to try and repair their marriage and rebuild trust. This is the hardest thing I’ve ever done in my 53 yrs. I hope she reads all of these because she is SUPER STRONG!!!

❤️ She isn’t weak for staying. It takes a lot of strength to navigate this bs. However- the fact she’s having second thoughts about staying and sees herself as weak is something she should explore. If she’s staying out of fear of being alone, for example.

💪  1) She has to like her own reasons for staying 2)she has to have her own back on her decision 3) cultural myth is nothing. This is her life. She gets to make the rules

❤️  It’s her life; she should do what she wants to do.

💪  Staying and putting in the work for a new marriage is SO much harder for betrayer & betrayed. Walking away isn’t easy & still requires years of healing but deciding to stay & become different & better requires strength; willingness to learn & grow, daily forgiveness, & hard work.

❤️  I have faced many people who would not do what I have done. Shown some compassion to a man who is truly sorry for his actions.

💪  Put herself first whether that means staying or going.

❤️   Staying takes far more strength than leaving. You have to be able to look past the lying, the deceit, the anger, the hate, the devastation, the destruction of your confidence and certainty and rebuild yourself and your relationship. You have to forgive without bitterness. But stay because you believe that it is the right thing to do for you or your family. Don't stay to meet other people's expectations and beliefs. If you stay, know that you will be stronger than you were before. Finally love and hugs from us. We know how hard it is.

💪  This is something I struggle with immensely too. Ppl are complex. Lives are complex. Love can survive & grow through adversity. The strongest people are those who can hold pain in their hearts & STILL stay someone who caused it. That's radical acceptance & love. Fk what ppl think

20 comments:

  1. I have been seriously struggling with this too. And for me I don't care what society says about staying - it IS my life and they don't have to live it. What I'm struggling with is my EGO. That awful battle within that tells me to leave that bastard, I was so good to him and he was an asshole and was ok losing me.

    My EGO tells me he doesn't deserve me, but then I realize that if I leave for that reason it's because I want to punish him, not because I actually want to leave.

    I too have a very hard time looking at him - even today when he is EXACTLY the person I have wanted my entire life (I'm almost 4 years from DDay #1) - but the struggle is that I feel valued now, but not then. I was disposable - and that is where I struggle.

    My struggle is that he was ok losing me when he was with all of those other women, building relationships with them and being an asshole to me - so what is wrong with me that I stayed when he was an asshole (before I knew about the other women), and I stayed after I found out, and I stayed after all of the DDays (and there have been several).

    Why the hell wouldn't I want to leave?

    That's my struggle - HELP!

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    1. Spouse, I'm so sorry for the pain you're still in. It comes through in every line. I'm not sure I have words that will make a difference. As you know, my husband also was/is a sex addict. I sometimes wonder if it's the "sex" part that complicates things because most of us think of sex as a good thing, an intimate thing. But when I think of my mother's alcohol and pill addiction, it helps me get clearer on addiction in general. It hurt a lot when I was a kid and my mother "chose" substances over me. One could argue she was "okay" with losing me rather than give up booze/pills. Of course, she wouldn't have been "okay". She would have been devastated. And that loss would have likely fuelled deeper shame leading to more substance abuse.
      My husband "chose" random encounters, affairs, etc. over me. He appeared to be "okay" with losing me rather than stop engaging in sexual acting out. But, similarly, he was driven by shame and self-loathing and was using sex as a way to manage/medicate/distract from those feelings.
      To hear my husband describe his encounters, whether with a stranger or affair partner, they sound like something you'd hear on the nature channel. "And now the male mounts the female. You can hear the grunting..." There was nothing loving or intimate about it. There was no genuine connection except between body parts. So yes, he "chose" that in the same way my mother "chose" vodka. Would I want either addiction? Absolutely not. And their poor choices were not a reflection on my own worth. Far from it.
      I wonder if that's part of what's tripping you up. If you still, on some level, feel as though his behaviour reflects your worth to him. If, on some level, you feel that he hasn't paid a high enough price for the pain he's caused. I suspect, if he's anything like my husband, the shame he's had to wade through to get to a place where he can look at himself and not cringe isn't something I would wish on anyone.
      Addicts are assholes. They do incredibly stupid things. They push away, intentionally or otherwise, exactly the people who most care about them. They cannot fathom that THEY are worth caring for and so they cause harm and pain.
      You absolutely do not need to stay with him. The door is there whenever you want to walk through it.
      But, if you're going to stay, even just for now, it would do you a world of good to try and come to terms with the fact that he was absolutely an asshole and he didn't deserve you then. And no amount of his being a good guy now is going to erase that. He will have to carry that truth with him the rest of his life -- that he hurt his best, most loyal friend in the worst way possible.
      But you can choose to know that while acknowledging that he is not that guy now. And you can choose this guy now, in front of you. The one who is doing what he can to ensure he's NEVER the other guy again.
      Giving him a second chance is a gift he doesn't deserve. It is mercy.
      But it is for you, too. You don't want to leave so why are you beating yourself up for not leaving? Why can't you just let yourself enjoy what you have right here, right now, knowing that you paid a HUGE price for it? I wish you peace, Spouse. I wish you the knowledge that none of us ever deserve the pain that others put us through but that we can nonetheless move past it. That people can change. That they often do.

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    2. I struggled for almost four years also. It takes an incredibly strong woman to stay. I made the decision to stay and then I made the very difficult decision to divorce. 29 years together and 26 married. He would never do the hard work to make me feel safe and to build the trust back. He quit therapy after 18 months which was a boundary on me staying. He kept telling me I was raising the bar too high. I kept telling him I was worth it. Truthfully I never moved the bar. Transparency and trust and safety were always priorities. Addicts want to keep that secret part of their life secret. I think Elle is absolutely correct when she says to look at what he is doing. Is he working hard at making you feel safe? At being trustworthy and transparent? My husband would tell the therapist he would do all the things necessary for me to heal, walk out of the room and forget everything be heard. I made the decision to leave when I knew he would never do what I needed to feel safe and I was done.

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    3. LilyLove, So great to hear from you. You are such an inspiration. I hope everyone will read your words: "I kept telling him I was worth it." and "look at what he is doing" And finally: "I made the decision to leave when I knew he would never do what I needed to feel safe and I was done."

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    4. I struggle too. I should have known all along. I married him at 16. Today was our 42nd wedding anniversary as with all the rest today went by with no acknowledgment. Three years since my d-day. But I should've seen it before, I didn't, I really thought our marriage was special I'm so stupid. I stayed for my family. He refused to admit, refused therapy I wish I could just go to therapy by myself.

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    5. Angel u were not stupid to believe in your marriage. He is the stupid one for not respecting you. If you want to go to therapy go without him. Don’t involve him if he wants to know what is said he will have to attend. Not man enough to face what he has done my h could not take it either. They convince themselves what they are doing is ok, and then when the reality is put to them it is too much. Do what is best for you take care xx

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  2. Tears Elle, tears are rolling down reading what you wrote. Yes, he hates himself so much for what he did that he attempted suicide in March 2017 and almost succeeded.

    His relationships were almost all romantic (he left me twice because he thought he was in love with 2 of them, but explained to me that he just wasn't in love with me anymore which made absolutely no sense because we got along so well and were best friends), weekend getaways, sleepovers and I love you's. One even sent an unsigned postcard to our house to taunt and make me question who it was from. I hate this so much I have so much rage in me when I think of what he did...hiding around the corner in his car on his phone talking to them, coming home to me touching things in our home after being with them, kissing me, ignoring my initiations for intimacy...I didn't even question him about anything, I just trusted, until the clues were too much to ignore.

    And yes, part of me feels like he got off (literally) and then gets to go free. I wouldn't want to be him either. He is so disgusted with himself and is so full of shame still to this day and will forever.

    I guess part of me is beating myself up because I feel tricked, and I feel stupid for ignoring so many clues. I would see/hear him do something and I would be like "hmmm that's strange..." but do nothing and ask nothing. I just trusted.

    I feel good many days, and the days I don't (usually for about 1 week out of the month if you know what I mean ;)) I toss out little jabs at him that come across as jokes, but I hate even thinking that way. I'm a nice woman who treated her man like a King, and I guess I still have some resentment which is to be expected.

    I miss the way I used to think, feel and look at him. Does it come back?

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    1. It came back for me. Well, not exactly. I'm not the same. I'm not as judgemental. I'm not a black-and-white. I'm far more willing to extend compassion while at the same time far less willing to tolerate mistreatment. I know who I am and like myself in a way I didn't before. I know who he is and like him in a way I couldn't before.
      "Love", of course, can also be an addiction. He could be addicted to the chase, the "get", the attention. Chasing a feeling rather than a person. And desperately confusing the two.
      In any case, Spouse, do what's right for you. And if you're not sure, then there's absolutely nothing wrong with taking time until you are. It took me a good five years before I felt pretty (not 100% but 95%) sure that I wasn't going to leave. And it has just kept getting better. Honestly.

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    2. Spouse of a Sex AddictDecember 9, 2020 at 10:37 AM

      Thank you Elle, I'm 90% sure I want to stay at this point so maybe I'm on track :)

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    3. I've pretty much stayed at 95%! The days of 100% are gone...and that's okay. Keeps him in line! 😉

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  3. These are always my struggles as well. I'm 100% I want to stay-- and also that I'm furious and miserable and I want to feel like there's retribution and punishment of some kind. I don't want to think he's getting away with it. Of course, he's not. He's doing a lot of hard work, on himself, and also frankly huge amounts of work around the house and in our shared lives and with the kids to give me back time to focus on myself and get better. He is doing the work. But I can't convince myself that it's enough. (Meanwhile, I'm a criminologist, and I'm also fascinated with my own response of wanting retribution and punishment... )

    I also think he hasn't come to terms with the cruelty of it. He feels terrible about hurting me, but insists he wasn't trying to hurt me. I think this may be true for many cheaters, but not my husband. He threw it in my face in a million ways. And then, I think, he (subconsciously) purposefully let me find out, so that I would end it for him. He didn't just reach out to feel better about his own insecurities-- his insecurities were focused on me, and he lashed out at me. I think. And how can I think it won't happen again, if he won't even acknowledge this part of it?

    I don't know where the line is between punishing him and protecting myself. I'm sure they overlap all the time. I agree with all the times Elle has written that it is not stupid or weak to be someone who chooses to love and forgive and open yourself to the risk of another heartbreak. But even though I believe that-- I can't seem to let myself do it. And the distance doesn't just punish him. It's three years now, the shock has warn off, being satisfied by him bending over backwards to make up for things has also warn off, and all I'm left with is this relationship that is nothing like the marriage I wanted to have. It's nice that he does all the work, but I still don't feel close to him, and a relationship where one person does all the work isn't a marriage. I want our team back. But I can't get myself to join it.

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    1. PearlH,
      Is your husband in therapy? I think that, without someone constantly pushing (however gently) for him to acknowledge what he did and why, it can be easy(er) to minimize or rewrite history or otherwise overlook just how painful it was for you. Whether he intended it that way or not. Doesn't matter. Betrayal is excruciating. Full stop.
      It sounds as though you're still unable to feel emotionally safe with him and that's an impossible foundation on which to build a marriage. If you're still doing the emotional heavy-lifting then, you're right, that's not a marriage. That's not a team.
      Sounds as though he needs to step up. If he won't, he's tell you some painful but valuable information. That this is the marriage you can expect with him. This is his opportunity to figure out how to be better.

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    2. Yes. He started agreed to therapy the night I found out and started a month later. He’s gone through a few different therapists though, starting over each time. This one thinks he traumatized himself when he hurt me so they “have to go slowly” which... I just don’t know. He’s in therapy and so much is much better. But I think his coming to terms with the trauma of his background has made him avoid personal responsibility to some extent. Yes, he did this out of a response to trauma. That doesn’t mean it was the trauma that did it though.

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    3. PearlH,
      I'm glad he's in therapy and, honestly, it can be wise to move slowly when you have a therapy-resister who's deep into denying his own trauma.
      And while trauma is never an "excuse" to harm someone else, it is an explanation. We either transform our own pain or we transmit it. Hurt people hurt people. That never ever makes it okay. And there are those, of course, who don't transmit their trauma onto others. But they, I think, are the exception.
      You get to choose whether you stick around but what you're saying -- that "so much is much better" bodes well.

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    4. Dear Pearl H....I am so sorry that what you have experienced has brought you here, to these pages, but I am glad for these pages and that we are here to support each other as best we can.
      A team, a husband-wife team, devoted, caring, trusting...is a team until one of them changes the rules and starts playing terrible games with their own rule book, without consulting their sole team-member. Your life is precious, and the very person you thought you could rely on until the end has destroyed your world. So the team can never be the same as it was. There is a loss of innocence. Can the team rebuild? Perhaps. It will be different, that's for sure. It can never ever be what it was. That is gone. If couples want to start anew, that is up to them. I imagine this to be a challenging and complicated process. I tried over 15 years, to trust and re-build with my husband....my grave error was that I picked up the slack and did all the work, did not act on my instincts that he was up to no good...blindly believed that our love would see us through. Nope. He just dove deeper and deeper into his secret world. His last transgression shattered me to the core, upon my discovery. That was 15 months ago. I kicked him out. In my 'bargaining stage'of grief I thought, maybe if he gets really good therapy he'll be brand new and we can start over again!...even if it's ten years down the road!....and then I realized that was insane thinking....was I to wait and wait and wait until he no longer needed to do the dirty things he needed to do? Wait for him to come around? what could he offer me that I was interested in? Was my life, MY precious life to be spent waiting and questioning? The hollow feeling that accompanies the shell of what-was was the absolute worst. So I chose to take care of me, to focus on me and not on what might happen down the road. I know you are still with your husband under the same roof and I feel your pain and doubt and lack of excitement. I'm truly sorry for this. But flip it around for a minute here....what if your husband finds a great therapist, and grows as a human being and truly wants to be part of your life...could you accept him again? could you trust him? Do you want to trust him? I think for myself, my husband has so horribly broken my trust that I would find it difficult to believe any new sincerity-passion-love coming from him. And that's on him. I have accepted that we came together for as long as we were supposed to and that the relationship, as I knew it, ended when it was supposed to. What does the future hold? who the heck knows. For my own healing/growth I meditate and focus on my spiritual life and know that the right path will unfold as long as I hold strong and true to myself. I wish you well...courage my friend, breathe through intense bits and keep checking in....

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  4. I am five years past d day. The above post is just how I feel. Lately I have scared myself as feelings have started to creep back in I instantly remind myself of what he did. The guard goes up and I am back to an empty shell playing at house when what I really want is a home and a husband. He can’t do anymore for me I know that so it really is on me now. How do I love respect and trust him again after breaking my heart and destroying our world. His affair made no sense to him and even less to me he just went on a rampage of total destruction for what and why he doesn’t know myself. I just can’t get past the feeling of how could he forget us all we had achieved together our safe little family. He says he forgot everything and just walked into trouble because the opportunity presented itself. How sad is that I forgot my wife my kids my life because someone opened their legs. I know it was not me it is on him but because he was such a fundamenral part of my life it is on me. So now he isn’t a fundamental part of my life my guard is up so actually no more heartbreak by my rules.

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    1. Question for you, Luppylu: You ask "how do I love, respect and trust him again..." to which I ask, "what is he doing to be lovable, respectable and trustworthy?" If he is doing all those things and you WANT to love/respect/trust him, then I think the issue is with your fear of being hurt again. But if he hasn't made himself lovable, respectable and trustworthy, then why would you feel those things?
      Has he sought therapy to figure out why he risked what mattered for what didn't? Is he lacking in honesty/integrity in other areas of his life and this was simply one more?

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    2. He is doing all the right things. But for me I guess it’s he did all the right things for 34 happy married years. He was such a good husband and father and look where he/we ended up. He tried therapy but could not cope with feeling like he did wrong!!!. He feels he just lost who he was. He retired from his job that he had for 39 years he had worked up to being in charge of a large department with lots of responsibility. He took a much lesser role in a different field to keep his mind active and felt lost just being a worker his ap was his clerical support by email . They worked in different areas of the district. Got friendly sending text jokes etc met up to out a face to the name. She had just broke up with her husband my h thought he was being nice helping her with sorting out issues. Ended up at her house one Friday afternoon and the rest us history. He says she hounded him if he didn’t go round she would bombard him with texts. I have seen his phone bills in excess if 3,500 texts a month between them. He kept thinking she would just go away he had to keep her sweet as she threatened to tell everyone. For me it sounds pathetic he should never have given her so much power and all his info on Facebook made it easy for her to know so much. He says he told her about his family as that’s what people do say married with grown up kids etc he never meant to have an affair. He struggles with knowing that’s what he did as feels he just lost the plot scared all the time feeling like he didn’t care about anything. But to me he came home and looked fine I never suspected anything. Madness

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  5. I know how both PearlH and Luppylu feel - I'm sure it's a common feeling for us all.

    I do know that a closed heart doesn't allow you to give love, but it also doesn't allow you to receive love. We may be open for a while, but then the realization of what he did comes back and we close again. This is what PTSD is, waves of feeling ok and then BAM! Walls up again to protect.

    I praise him all the time for how much work he has done, how much he has overcome (the suicide attempt) but he has never really praised me for all of the work I've done to overcome to be able to love him still. Maybe if he did I would feel I could be more open, but him not acknowledging it makes me feel like he doesn't know how much it destroyed me and how much pain I am still in almost 4 years later. He doesn't want to talk about it or bring it up and I understand that, but he also knows it's always there. It really is up to us to find our peace.

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    1. Yes, it is up to us. And, in my case, I had to acknowledge that I was, in some ways, wishing my husband was a different person. He will never be someone who thinks to tell me how proud he is of me, though I hear constantly from others that he tells them. My husband isn't a romantic but will buy me an office chair because I mention that my back is sore from my old one. We speak different "love languages" and we've had to learn, albeit imperfectly, how to communicate.
      And, like you, I had to learn too that a closed heart keeps out the hurt but it also keeps out the joy.

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